Twice in One Day

MD Longhorn · #1 (**permalink**) Mon Sep 10, 2012, 04:34pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rich

Is this a softball thing? Just curious. Cause I sure as heck do it in baseball, at all levels.

I've been told by 2 different baseball people (an assigner and a clinician) not to say it in baseball either. At most, hold the OUT signal a little longer. Also, in both, the only other difference I've been told is to not do the Leslie Neilson punch-out on a D3K - just a quick, "Strike three" mechanic.

Rich · #2 (**permalink**) Mon Sep 10, 2012, 04:48pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by mbcrowder

I've been told by 2 different baseball people (an assigner and a clinician) not to say it in baseball either. At most, hold the OUT signal a little longer. Also, in both, the only other difference I've been told is to not do the Leslie Neilson punch-out on a D3K - just a quick, "Strike three" mechanic.

Well, just goes to show that clinicians have personal preferences.

We do a loud, "Batter's out! Batter's out!" If we can stop the circus music from playing, all the better.

BretMan · #3 (**permalink**) Mon Sep 10, 2012, 05:27pm

I say, "Batter out!", ONLY on an uncaught third strike when the batter isn't entitled to advance, and then ONLY if the batter does actually start to advance (beyond a couple of cursory steps toward first).

So, it's not, "Strike three, batter's out!". It's, "Strike three!", then pause, then read the batter, then emphasize that she's out if she continues advancing.

ronald · #4 (**permalink**) Mon Sep 10, 2012, 09:15pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by BretMan

I say, "Batter out!", ONLY on an uncaught third strike when the batter isn't entitled to advance, and then ONLY if the batter does actually start to advance (beyond a couple of cursory steps toward first).

So, it's not, "Strike three, batter's out!". It's, "Strike three!", then pause, then read the batter, then emphasize that she's out if she continues advancing.

Exactly

tcannizzo · #5 (**permalink**) Mon Sep 10, 2012, 09:32pm

The only time I stop a batter from going to 1B is when it is only "Ball 3" or "Strike 2", and I may not be 100% correct in doing that either.

IRISHMAFIA · #6 (**permalink**) Tue Sep 11, 2012, 11:46am

[quote=BretMan]I say, "Batter out!", ONLY on an uncaught third strike when the batter isn't entitled to advance, and then ONLY if the batter does actually start to advance (beyond a couple of cursory steps toward first).

So, it's not, "Strike three, batter's out!". It's, "Strike three!", then pause, then read the batter, then emphasize that she's out if she continues advancing.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ronald

Exactly

Add me to this group. I don't think either will disagree with me when I say that the umpire shouldn't be chasing the player down the line or screaming at the top of his/her lungs, just a simple "batter's out" at a voice no louder than the strike call.

This is a situational exception, as BretMan has noted, to the routine mechanic, not a standard mechanic.

As for the 40 Days of Ronald (hey, is that a movie?), I believe he is referring to a recent trip to OKC.

DaveASA/FED · #7 (**permalink**) Tue Sep 11, 2012, 12:43pm

I agree with how Bretman described this situation. ASA does NOT want you to say "Batter's out" as a routine in your called third, but if they start to run and are not entitled to advance I have been instructed to then say "Batter's out, Batter's out" and as Mike said not YELLING it but saying it in the tone you would call a strike in, like loud enough that it should be able to be heard by catcher.

tcannizzo · #8 (**permalink**) Tue Sep 11, 2012, 12:51pm

Rule 8. Section 7. THE RUNNER IS OUT.
P. When, after being declared out or after scoring, an offensive player interferes
with a defensive player's opportunity to make a play on another runner.
EFFECT: The ball is dead. The runner closest to home plate at the time of the
interference is out. All runners not out must return to the last base touched
at the time of the interference.
NOTE: A runner continuing to run and drawing a throw may be considered
a form of interference. This does not apply to a batter-runner who is entitled
to run on the dropped third strike rule.

I could swear there was a recent thread about this, but I cannot find it.
As I recall, this was the citation that allows running to 1B, but not beyond 1B.

Rita C · #9 (**permalink**) Mon Sep 10, 2012, 10:17pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by BretMan

I say, "Batter out!", ONLY on an uncaught third strike when the batter isn't entitled to advance, and then ONLY if the batter does actually start to advance (beyond a couple of cursory steps toward first).

So, it's not, "Strike three, batter's out!". It's, "Strike three!", then pause, then read the batter, then emphasize that she's out if she continues advancing.

But then that's what I knew Manny was doing even though he hadn't specified that there were fewer than two outs.

So, no offense, but "duh!" It's always only "Strike three" but if she takes off and she's not entitled, it's "Batter's out! Batter's out!"

But that's for baseball. So you all are saying, one doesn't do it for softball?

Rita

tcannizzo · #10 (**permalink**) Mon Sep 10, 2012, 11:09pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rita C

But then that's what I knew Manny was doing even though he hadn't specified that there were fewer than two outs.

So, no offense, but "duh!" It's always only "Strike three" but if she takes off and she's not entitled, it's "Batter's out! Batter's out!"

But that's for baseball. So you all are saying, one doesn't do it for softball?

Rita

That is correct. We do not do that in FPSB.

Dakota · #11 (**permalink**) Tue Sep 11, 2012, 06:42am

Quote:

Originally Posted by tcannizzo

...We do not do that in FPSB.

News to me.

Andy · #12 (**permalink**) Tue Sep 11, 2012, 10:13am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dakota

News to me.

Me too.....

Manny A · #13 (**permalink**) Tue Sep 11, 2012, 07:09am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rita C

But then that's what I knew Manny was doing even though he hadn't specified that there were fewer than two outs.

I didn't think I had to specify, Rita, since the result of both situations was a strike-out/throw-out DP.

I have never been told at any NCAA, ASA, or NFHS clinics I've attended that the "BATTER'S OUT! BATTER'S OUT!" is not an accepted mechanic in this situation. In fact, the CCA Softball Manual instructs the plate umpire to verbalize, "The batter is out," if she tries to advance to first.

I've used it for years in front of numerous tournament UCs, and they've never come up to me afterwards and critiqued me to simply signal the swinging strike.

Rita C · #14 (**permalink**) Tue Sep 11, 2012, 11:16am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Manny A

I didn't think I had to specify, Rita, since the result of both situations was a strike-out/throw-out DP.

Exactly.

Rita

BretMan · #15 (**permalink**) Tue Sep 11, 2012, 08:47am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rita C

So, no offense, but "duh!"

Maybe I was clarifying that for readers less astute than yourself.

Since we have some posters saying that we should NEVER use, "Batter out", and some saying that we should, I wanted to make it clear exactly what mechanic we were discussing.

I have been told to not use, "Batter out", as part of my routine strike three call (and I don't). If you just automatically say it on every called third strike then you are eventually going to say it when the batter really isn't out. Then you'll have the fun of dealing with the mess you just made by declaring a batter out who wasn't.

These are two completely different situations, requiring two completely different mechanics. While this might be "Duh" stuff for the experienced umpires here, the difference hadn't really been noted.