casual profanity

[shipwreck]

Could someone aim me in the right direction on the rule against casual profanity? I officiate in Nebraska and I know we have a rule against it but cannot seem to find it in the ASA manual. Thanks, Dave

[kellerumps]

Not a rule in the ASA rulebook that I am aware of.....What level are you talking about?

In NCAA, Mens FP and Womens Open FP we tolerate a whole lot more than say 12-U.

[shipwreck]

In Nebraska I am pretty sure it is in all levels. They adopted it a few years ago. I believe it is an automatic out, even if there are three outs when it occurs, it will carry over to the next inning. Dave

[shipwreck]

I just found it in our Nebraska ASA 2003 Procedural Codes. Here is what it says, "The umpire has the authority to assess ONE OUT against the offending team for the use of CASUAL PROFANITY which shall be defined as expletives(Vulgar or Profane Language) not directed at umpires or opposing players, uttered by a player, manager/coach, on the field or individual within the dugout involved with the play of the team, frustrated with themselves, a teammate or fan. All outs will be assessed against the offending team during their term at bat. Only ONE "Casual Profanity" out may be assessed per play with a maximum of two (2) per term at bat. Incidents of vulgar or profane language exceeding these limits will subject the individuals responsible to ejection from the game for unsportsmanlike conduct. A player ejected from the game for exceeding these limits will not have a casual profanity out charged to the team. The Casual Profanity penalty "out" will be assessed as a team and will not affect any batter or base runner. For scoring purposes, the putout will be credited to the catcher. Dave

[chris s]

Originally posted by shipwreck
I just found it in our Nebraska ASA 2003 Procedural Codes. Here is what it says, "The umpire has the authority to assess ONE OUT against the offending team for the use of CASUAL PROFANITY which shall be defined as expletives(Vulgar or Profane Language) not directed at umpires or opposing players, uttered by a player, manager/coach, on the field or individual within the dugout involved with the play of the team, frustrated with themselves, a teammate or fan. All outs will be assessed against the offending team during their term at bat. Only ONE "Casual Profanity" out may be assessed per play with a maximum of two (2) per term at bat. Incidents of vulgar or profane language exceeding these limits will subject the individuals responsible to ejection from the game for unsportsmanlike conduct. A player ejected from the game for exceeding these limits will not have a casual profanity out charged to the team. The Casual Profanity penalty "out" will be assessed as a team and will not affect any batter or base runner. For scoring purposes, the putout will be credited to the catcher. Dave

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Kid smacks one off his/her foot and say "****" or F$$$ or whatever, you gotta toss em? WOW!!!

[Dakota]

Originally posted by chris s

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Kid smacks one off his/her foot and say "****" or F$$$ or whatever, you gotta toss em? WOW!!!

No. As I read this, you charge the team with an out & the batter continues the time at bat.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally posted by shipwreck
I just found it in our Nebraska ASA 2003 Procedural Codes. Here is what it says, "The umpire has the authority to assess ONE OUT against the offending team for the use of CASUAL PROFANITY which shall be defined as expletives(Vulgar or Profane Language) not directed at umpires or opposing players, uttered by a player, manager/coach, on the field or individual within the dugout involved with the play of the team, frustrated with themselves, a teammate or fan. All outs will be assessed against the offending team during their term at bat. Only ONE "Casual Profanity" out may be assessed per play with a maximum of two (2) per term at bat. Incidents of vulgar or profane language exceeding these limits will subject the individuals responsible to ejection from the game for unsportsmanlike conduct. A player ejected from the game for exceeding these limits will not have a casual profanity out charged to the team. The Casual Profanity penalty "out" will be assessed as a team and will not affect any batter or base runner. For scoring purposes, the putout will be credited to the catcher. Dave

Sorry, I don't buy into this type of rule, it's application or it's penalties.

This is just one more thing dumped on the umpire due to someone else's concern, but lack of willingness to control it. I have enough to do without being the language police on the ball field.

There is a local rule which gives the umpire the ability to "cool down" a player in these situations by DQing them for the game. You will not see me using that rule. I will often remind and/or request players and coaches to refrain from what "I" perceive as profanity, but if a player is behaving that poorly, I will eject them.

Such a rule is often open to a large range of interpretation by the umpire AND the opposing teams. You have people interjecting religious beliefs into the issue. Under a rule used in Richmond, VA. I once witnessed an umpire give the team at bat an extra out just for the pitcher using the word "god" after a line drive got by him. He uttered no other words than god. I was the on-deck batter and had no problem telling the umpire such an application was ridiculous even though my team benefitted from her ruling. Last I heard, this umpire was ASA President Frank Taylor's personal assitant. There's a real shock.

I've also heard players admonished for the use of damn, hell and even "gee's Louise".

I have better things to do than be arrogant enough to think that my beliefs should apply to all.

[CecilOne]

Then where do we draw the line, and should there be a standard?

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally posted by CecilOne
Then where do we draw the line, and should there be a standard?

Who would set that standard? George Carlin or Jerry Falwell? To loosely, very loosely paraphrase Burt Reynolds in Smokey and the Bandit, I all depends on where you are standing in this country which determines how smart you are. Same thing goes for what may be considered vulgar or profane and that can change from neighborhood to neighborhood.

I will always use ASA 10.9.A-C. If it's not directed at a coach, player or umpire, I'm not overly concerned about it. And many of you will disagree with this, but my job concerns the people inside the fence, not those in the stands.

One of my pet peeves in life are those who watch a particular TV show, attend a sporting event, opening a magazine knowing full well what is going to be heard and seen and then complaining about it as if the rest of the world should accommodate them alone.

I once had a player complain about another's language. I looked at this guy and reminded him that he has one of the filthiest mouths I have ever heard. He agreed, but his wife and kids were there that night and he wanted ME to control everyone else for something he does regularly. I told him if it happens, it wouldn't be my doing, but his. When I asked him how he felt about it when other player's families were there to hear him, he told me he didn't give a f*** about them, just his family.

Nope, I'm not getting into the middle of this type of crap. Got enough to do with controlling the game as it is without setting social standards for others.

[CecilOne]

Thank you.

[ASA/NYSSOBLUE]

Originally posted by shipwreck
I just found it in our Nebraska ASA 2003 Procedural Codes. Here is what it says, "The umpire has the authority to assess ONE OUT against the offending team for the use of CASUAL PROFANITY which shall be defined as expletives(Vulgar or Profane Language) not directed at umpires or opposing players, uttered by a player, manager/coach, on the field or individual within the dugout involved with the play of the team, frustrated with themselves, a teammate or fan. All outs will be assessed against the offending team during their term at bat. Only ONE "Casual Profanity" out may be assessed per play with a maximum of two (2) per term at bat. Incidents of vulgar or profane language exceeding these limits will subject the individuals responsible to ejection from the game for unsportsmanlike conduct. A player ejected from the game for exceeding these limits will not have a casual profanity out charged to the team. The Casual Profanity penalty "out" will be assessed as a team and will not affect any batter or base runner. For scoring purposes, the putout will be credited to the catcher. Dave

SHEESH! If we had that here...thered be nobody left to play! Apparently everything else in Nebraska softball is just fine and dandy...

[KentuckyBlue]

There's a strange little independent national association (calling it that gives it WAY much more dignity than it deserves) in Versailles, Ky. (and hey, we hillbillies pronounce that Ver-SALES, not ver-sigh) whose rules will toss a player for "g.d." but apparently doesn't care about other profanities. Like Mike, I'm uncomfortable with this -- just because some guy is head honcho we've all got to observe his little language quirks? Not that I'm encouraging people to belt out a string every time they pop up or fly out -- my 11-year-old daughter's often among the many children in the crowd.

But a game ain't a Sunday service and I'm not worried about their immortal souls. Even if I were, I don't happen to believe that there's a word or phrase you can say that's strong enough to put your soul in jeopardy. (which means being at the risk of being put out -- of heaven, presumably.) Jeez Louise, I can't even get the infield fly rule straight, don't ask me to interpret theology.

[lildani14]

lol..fine and dandy in Nebraska? pretty sure we're the same as everyone else. most umpire's that I've worked with and played for don't enforce this rule. In fact I don't think that I've seen any umpire use this rule in a game. Maybe we're just too good at not getting caught...

[Rachel]

Minnesota has a casual profanity rule. It seems to work. It makes the AA leagues a little more "family condusive". People can control what they say and that rule makes them have that control. A swear word uttered under the breath is one thing but a projectile is another.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally posted by Rachel
Minnesota has a casual profanity rule. It seems to work. It makes the AA leagues a little more "family condusive". People can control what they say and that rule makes them have that control. A swear word uttered under the breath is one thing but a projectile is another.

That's fine if the players abide by it, but I'm not going to be the umpire who enforces it. I have a request. I would like you to define "swear word". And that's where part of my problem lies. What you consider a swear word in MN, may not be in NJ, NY or many other states, but may be in VA, GA or the Carolinas.