Calling the obvious out
 

I searched but didn't find definitive answers.

I work ASA/NFHS and have a question on the requirement on calls for the pop up in the infield that is caught or a runner thrown out at 1B by 20 feet.

If it's "obvious" to everyone in the park, I usually signal w/ the hammer, hold it for 3-4 seconds and say nothing.

We have a guy new to our association [ASA] whose signal is a closed fist given with a little flip of the elbow/wrist down at belt level.

When I asked him about it, he said:

"In HS/College we are encouraged to NOT call obvious outs--the kind that everyone in the park understands is an out. Just a sign and no verbal is the standard. It fall under the current trend to not embarass or show-up a kid when the play can stand for itself."

Well, he's now working church league ball, not college or even HS. However, I still think the proper mechanic should be given, even if no verbal is made.

Comments?

I do what you do.

I do what you do, although not as long (maybe 1 or 1 1/2 seconds tops). However, I HAVE heard his comments made in a clinic before. I make a minimalist signal because if you do absolutely nothing, there may be someone who thinks you're not making a call because the obvious out is not an out after all (for whatever reason). I don't like his "signal" as it's not necessarily obvious what he's calling. I'd rather see nothing than a signal that is not known by all.

I'm about the same as Mike.

On a routine play at first, I will wait until the runner passes the bag or gives up running to signal the out. I was taught this when I first started to help with timing and make myself wait to make the call. I still have the habit.

So why do we signal the obvious outs, but not the obvious safes?

We don't signal the obvious safes?
I was taught that every play deserves a call.

Now if there isn't a play you don't need a safe call.

On the routine, obvious to everyone, out (such as out by several steps at 1B), I'll wait a few and then just give a casual hammer.

As do I and as a matter of routine I will also verbalize the "out", but I doubt anyone more than 5' away can hear it

What about a "casual" safe on an obvious safe, like a runner there 2 secs before the ball and no tag attempt?

Betting he does baseball. Where the "short hammer" is often used for obvious outs.

The only signals given in softball at belt level or inside the body are those defined as umpire-to-umpire. Any signal given that signifies a strike or an out is intended to be given above shoulder height.

Because every runner is safe, until they are out. If it isn't close and everyone knows the runner is not out, why tell them?

On the obvious out, their status has changed. That deserves a call.

No, because there was no play made to call, or, as MNBlue says, the runner's status has not changed. Why not signal "safe" every time a runner touches the bag?

Or point to home plate everytime a run scores..:rolleyes:

Good points, all 3 of you.
My example was extreme to avoid any HTBT replies.
What about same basic play when fielder receives ball just after runner reaches, then holds tag to see if runner will slip off?
HTBT not accepted.

Casual safe, since there seems to be some doubt as to the runner's status. Call time if all play is stopped and the fielder isn't taking the tag off and the runner isn't moving.

I guess the easiest way would be to say that if I think there's ANY reason that ANYONE might need to know the runner is still safe, or that anyone might be unclear, I'll signal the slow safe sign. Fielder holding the tag on a safe runner on a bag for no reason is a perfect example.

Maybe it's just me, but I think people who believe making an Out call on an obvious play will embarrass or show-up a kid are way too oversensitive. True, we shouldn't come through with a punch-out call on a base that dislocates our shoulders. :D But making anything more than an imperceptible hand gesture is embarrassing? Puhleeze.

What should we do when a pitcher delivers one waist high right smack-down the middle of the plate on two strikes, and the batter watches it go by? That one's pretty obvious, too, isn't it? Should we just give a nonchalant hand signal without the verbal, and save the sells only for the ones that nibble the corners at the knees?

not because of rubbing it in or not, but to show we knew it was not close; saving the sell for close ones, ball down the line with runner on, called thirds, etc.