Player blocking my view

WestMichBlue · #1 (**permalink**) Thu May 29, 2003, 08:20am

ASA Men's FP. 6'5" F4 that backs up 1B and 2B and gets in my way.

Ground ball on infield, I have come off A to set position, following ball to 1B - and F4 comes in front of me! Told him that if he gets in my way, he is not going to get an out call.

R1 stealing 2B. I am moving parallel, waiting for F4 to clear. But he also moves parallel. I turn in to make the call and there he is.

Question: do I call one safe, let everyone yip, and send a message? Or is my obligation to get the call right and go to my partner for help, claiming that my view was blocked?

WMB

kono · #2 (**permalink**) Thu May 29, 2003, 08:47am

Check with your partner - but if neither of you see an out, you can't call one.

Beyond that, all you can do is try to anticipate where he will be moving to and adjust.

Steve M · #3 (**permalink**) Thu May 29, 2003, 10:34am

Call the runner safe. You've already said something to F4, now act on it. F4 will figure out soon enough that he needs to allow you to see the play in order to get the out. This is assuming that you've made all reasonable minor adjustments to your positioning that you can.

Steve M

IRISHMAFIA · #4 (**permalink**) Thu May 29, 2003, 11:58am

With all due respect to those who responded, the field belongs to the players, not the umpires. A fielder moving to a play or to back up a play is doing what they are supposed to do. The umpire, knowing this player is going to be backing up the play needs to adjust the best they can.

I don't believe you can consider this the same as a player milling around with no purpose on a play just trying to get a better view of a tag or a ball on the line. In those types of cases, I have no problem "giving" the call to the opponent, just as you would do when a catcher stands up on you at the last second.

WestMichBlue · #5 (**permalink**) Thu May 29, 2003, 12:27pm

Can't disagree with anything you said, Mike, but with respect to the following - there is a right way, and a wrong way to back up a play. "A fielder moving to a play or to back up a play is doing what they are supposed to do.

You don't back up a play 5' behind the bag. You have no time to react to a missed throw. I have this problem a lot with H.S. players at 2B; I didn't expect it with adult male players.

When a runner goes for 2nd my first steps are parallel to the base line with an eye on F4. I expect her to go diagonally towards F8 to put herself 10' - 15' behind second. When she clears me I turn in towards 2B to make the call.

Maybe you can fault my mechanics. I want to end up 8' to 10' behind and just to the RF side of 2B. When F4 runs parallel to me she ends up between me and the tag.

In H.S. play I have sometimes bumped F4 or put my hands to her shoulder and pushed her aside. Then after the play I talk to her about not coming in front of me when I am making a call. That always solves it; H.S. kids learn quickly. But this dude was 6'5" (and 40 yrs youngers) and I'm not sure that I wanted to be pushing him!

WMB

IRISHMAFIA · #6 (**permalink**) Thu May 29, 2003, 04:16pm

Quote:

Originally posted by WestMichBlue
Can't disagree with anything you said, Mike, but with respect to the following - there is a right way, and a wrong way to back up a play. "A fielder moving to a play or to back up a play is doing what they are supposed to do.

You don't back up a play 5' behind the bag. You have no time to react to a missed throw. I have this problem a lot with H.S. players at 2B; I didn't expect it with adult male players.

When a runner goes for 2nd my first steps are parallel to the base line with an eye on F4. I expect her to go diagonally towards F8 to put herself 10' - 15' behind second. When she clears me I turn in towards 2B to make the call.

Maybe you can fault my mechanics. I want to end up 8' to 10' behind and just to the RF side of 2B. When F4 runs parallel to me she ends up between me and the tag.

In H.S. play I have sometimes bumped F4 or put my hands to her shoulder and pushed her aside. Then after the play I talk to her about not coming in front of me when I am making a call. That always solves it; H.S. kids learn quickly. But this dude was 6'5" (and 40 yrs youngers) and I'm not sure that I wanted to be pushing him!

WMB

Why not? The bigger they are, the harder they fall.

I can understand the problem. Some may consider it coaching, but just as you ask F4 who is taking the throw on the steal or pivot of a DP, ask him where he is going and if it seems he's going to end up in your way, tell him you need to be able to see the play and it would benefit all if he were _________.

Just a thought.

DownTownTonyBrown · #7 (**permalink**) Thu May 29, 2003, 05:57pm

Mike has got it right. We need to adjust. I think talking to this guy is a must and do it first. Explain to him that you want to call an out just as much as he wants one. Ask for his help. Explain your predicament. "I can't call it if I can't see it."

And, if you are really daring, then you can do some coaching and suggest that he perform his back-up function from a little greater distance .... behind you.

Jason A · #8 (**permalink**) Thu May 29, 2003, 09:26pm

Adjust to the player. Position yourself deeper or off a little bit. It doesn't take long to get a feel for a players habits.

One time, I had this player who used to play deep. So deep that she was almost in the outfield. I asked her, "Why do you play so deep?" and she responded, "Because I like to."

So i didn't stand behind her, I went in front of her. I knew from where she was and where I was, I could get out of he angle of play on the ball.

Jason A.
Coldwater Idaho

kono · #9 (**permalink**) Thu May 29, 2003, 10:05pm

Quote:

Originally posted by IRISHMAFIA
With all due respect to those who responded, the field belongs to the players, not the umpires. A fielder moving to a play or to back up a play is doing what they are supposed to do. The umpire, knowing this player is going to be backing up the play needs to adjust the best they can.

I agree Mike, and even said earlier that one would need to try and anticipate his moves and adjust.

BUT... if he's blocking my view on a play at first from the infield, he ain't backing up the throw. Same with the runner stealing 2nd. If he's in my way, he ain't backing up the throw from the catcher.

JMHO

-Kono

ChampaignBlue · #10 (**permalink**) Fri May 30, 2003, 05:04pm

Here's a case that I believe the field belongs to the ump.

Last night I had a long fly ball hit down the 3rd base line and just before a running left fielder caught the ball here comes F6 to stand directly on the line. I signaled fair then called the catch. I then informed F6 that I need to have the line or the benefit of the doubt goes to the offense.6" one way or the other is all I need. No problems after that.

And of course we've all had the on deck guy that needs a good look at the play at the plate.

IRISHMAFIA · #11 (**permalink**) Fri May 30, 2003, 06:10pm

Quote:

Originally posted by ChampaignBlue
Here's a case that I believe the field belongs to the ump.

Last night I had a long fly ball hit down the 3rd base line and just before a running left fielder caught the ball here comes F6 to stand directly on the line. I signaled fair then called the catch. I then informed F6 that I need to have the line or the benefit of the doubt goes to the offense.6" one way or the other is all I need. No problems after that.

And of course we've all had the on deck guy that needs a good look at the play at the plate.

Yep, not problem with that which is why I mentioned it earlier. However, I usually don't have a problem with the on-deck batter. I try to place myself in front of him/her and take two steps back saying, "I need this space". They either get the hint and back off, or I keep pushing back until I need to release to get into position for the play. With many of the fields in my area, that often presses them against the backstop.