Crow Hop?

[waggs]

We have a pitcher in our league that starts on the rubber but her first step is off with the non stride leg. My question is this a crow hop. I thought you had to push off the rubber and then stride out. She steps off pushes in front off the rubber and the strides. I asked the umpire and he said that it was not, that was just part of her motion? Any replies? Thanks.

[SC Ump]

From what you have described, I would say that is a crow hop. But, there might have been a misunderstanding in your communications with the umpire.

Remember that the "non-stride" foot does not have to remain motionless. The pitcher could slide it as her first movement, as long as it remains in contact with the pitching plate. A dance instructor might interpret this as "a step" where by softball rules it is not.

And of course, during the delivery that foot can also be drug away from the pitching plate, thus actually not being in contact with the pitching plate at the time the ball is released.

The pitching rule is quite technical. A comment in passing to an umpire on the field, or a post on a bulletin board that does not mention all the specifics, might lead to difficulty in understanding the whole situation.

[CecilOne]

In spite of the possible misinterpretation, if "steps off pushes in front off the rubber" means that the pivot foot is off the pitching plate for the pushoff, that would be illegal.

[Dakota]

I agree, Cecil. Sometimes we get too balled up in all of the words in the crow hop definition and the legal delivery rules.

Here is a simplification of the crow hop definition, that I think covers everything:

CROW HOP. A pitching motion whereby the pitcher pushes off from any place besides the pitcher's plate. This is an illegal act.

[bobbrix]

can't recall how i heard about this site, but check out the videos and read the text .... it's worth the wait if you have a slower computer

if you study the videos over and over, eventually you start to notice the legal versus the illegal and the good mechanics versus the injurious


http://www.pitchhit.com/mainpages/Pit%20by%20Rules.html



(btw, i vote crow hop based on your original question)

[waggs]

Thanks for all the input. The player in mention actually does step off the rubber not far but it is a step. She does not slide it across on the rubber as you had mentioned. So by what I gather it is concidered a crow hop by definition. Thanks you all for the reply

[Dakota]

Bob,

That web site has been largely discredited by those knowledgable about fastpitch pitching rules. The author of the site is a pitching coach who has been carrying on a crusade against the so-called "leap and drag" pitching style, which most top pichers use ("leap" is a misnomer, since despite what the author of the site says, the "leap and drag" pitcher is not commiting an illegal "leap.").

His main agenda is that the leap and drag is dangerous and causes injury and he has been trying to construct a case that it is illegal in order to get it banned.

It may be dangerous (I'm no expert on that), but it is not illegal, and it is not a crow hop.

His videos of what is legal and what is illegal are also slanted to his point of view - and that view is that the non-pivot foot should only "step". IOW, he thinks any pitching motion other that the "step style" is illegal.

[bobbrix]

Yes, Dakota, your comments are valid.

I just find the videos worth studying, for each ump's own experience and judgement. (Didn't mean to imply I agree or disagree with the author.)

Anyway, I'm convinced that on some of those clips you can see a definite 2nd push off the pivot foot (at/near the end of the drag). Not obvious at first glance but after a few replays I think it gets easier to spot.

Regardless of the author's intentions, the videos allow us to (repeatedly) concentrate on those split-second events that we just can't possible study on the diamond. Better to see what you might end up judging now than being
faced with it without ever knowing it was out there.

Regards to all. ... bobbrix