Slappers

[dilligaf]

I am somewhat new to umpiring compared to may of my colleagues. I have done around 200 games so far and overall have enjoyed the experience.

My question is regarding slap hitters. How often is the rule enforced when the batters front plant foot is clearly out of the box and planted on the ground prior to making contact with the ball? I had my first instance where I called this last weekend in a local tournament and the offensive coach went nuts when I called the batter out for the infraction. He stated that nobody ever makes the call and that I should just let his girls play. I don’t think it helped that he was down by 9 runs either and was overall frustrated with the way his girls were playing.

How often do you make this call? Just curious.

Many Thanks

[NCASAUmp]

100% of the time we see it.

Sit down and think of a new line, coach.

[MD Longhorn]

Well, consider all of the following:

1) for a batter to be out for contacting the ball while outside the box, the entire foot must be entirely outside the batters box AND contacting the ground at the moment the pitch is struck.
2) the batters box extends toward the pitcher considerably farther than most people think.
3) MOST of the time, by the 3rd batter, that box is gone, at least the top line.
4) when a pitch is coming in, what is PU looking at? Hopefully the ball itself.

So ... PU's job is to watch the ball as it comes in, so is looking at the ball. To call an out, you must see the foot, the ground, and know exactly where that box is, all while looking at the ball and not the foot or the ground.

I think you can probably see where this is going.

I'm not saying this should NEVER be called. But what I am saying is that being sure of EVERY thing you are supposed to be sure of to make this an out only happens in the rarest of occasions. And I would bet that of all the times I've called it - more than 75% came when batter began a slap, pitcher threw a change, and the batter still hit the ball - usually after falling WAY forward on a pitch I had likely stopped tracking due to it being an obvious ball.

On a normal pitch, it's very very difficult to be absolutely sure of ALL of the things you need to have for there to be an out.

[Dutch Alex]

Mike, I've couldn't have it more clear than you just did!
Once in a men's game I've called it several times: They stepped back right-foot just to break open on the bunt. Many of those long toe's got complete out of the box.
Then they claimed the box was to small. After the fieldmanager came out to let me see the lines were correct drawn, I was to blame for all the reasons Mike just explaned...

In our ladies BigLeague we have many slappers. I've never seen nor did myself call one of these young ladies out for this reason!

[JEL]

dilligaf,

I'm with NCASAUmp here. Call it when you see it, but just make sure you DO see it.

And since you are new, this is just for you;

Nobody ever makes that call, or an illegal pitch call, or leaving early call! You are the first and ONLY umpire that has dared to make such a call!

"Go back to the dugout coach, and I will let the girls play!"

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Observationa No. 1: All slap hitter should be drowned at birth. No I am just kidding but slap hitters are a real pain in the tuchus when umpiring.

Question No. 1: Can the BU make this call?

MTD, Sr.

[Andy]

Can the BU make this call? Yes

Should the BU make this call? No

BU is too far away to have any credibility in making this call - especially when the lines are gone.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by Andy

Can the BU make this call? Yes

Should the BU make this call? No

BU is too far away to have any credibility in making this call - especially when the lines are gone.

MTD, Jr. and I had a girls' 14U ASA FP game in July where I was the BU and it was the top of the 1st with 2 outs and no one on. The batter hit the ball with both feet in front of the batters box and I made the call from the A position and not a word was said from any of the batter's coaches. In fact, I called her out her next at bat for the exact same infraction. I think that the there are times when the BU in the A position has the best look at this particular infraction. Just my 2 cents.

MTD, Sr.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by Andy

Can the BU make this call? Yes

Should the BU make this call? No

BU is too far away to have any credibility in making this call - especially when the lines are gone.

Somewhat agree, but I think everyone is making too much out of this.

This violation isn't that hard to call especially when the foot is in front of the plate. If it is bad enough to call, the violation will most likely be so obvious it will grab your attention.

Seeing this will almost become second nature, much like an experienced umpire gets a feel for the player's abilities around him/her.

Please understand, I'm not suggesting you call it if you think you see this. This is one of those calls that if you have to think about it, don't call it.

[Welpe]

dilligaf, just tell the coach what your user name stands for.

[KJUmp]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

MTD, Jr. and I had a girls' 14U ASA FP game in July where I was the BU and it was the top of the 1st with 2 outs and no one on. The batter hit the ball with both feet in front of the batters box and I made the call from the A position and not a word was said from any of the batter's coaches. In fact, I called her out her next at bat for the exact same infraction. I think that the there are times when the BU in the A position has the best look at this particular infraction. Just my 2 cents.

MTD, Sr.

How did the PU (MTD Jr.?) not see both feet out of the batter's box?

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by KJUmp

How did the PU (MTD Jr.?) not see both feet out of the batter's box?

MTD, Jr. is only in his 3rd year of umpiring and is still learning. Regarding umpiring he does H.S. baseball and the only softball he umpires is summer ASA and USSSA FP so he has not seen slappers all that much in his young career.

MTD, Sr.