Ngb

[Snocatzdad]

I've heard referenced several times that ASA is the National Governing Body of Softball. This is all a little tongue in cheek, but I am curious

Couldn't the NCAA make that same claim? Don't they set rules (not adopt from ASA) Determine National Champions and doesn't performance in NCAA softball have a bigger impact on placement on US National teams than performance in ASA? (i.e. if Jenny Finch grew up east coast and played PONY would they have passed on her for the olympic team for failure to play ASA?)

Even if historically at some point ASA was clearly the NGB, does that ever come up for re-election?

Seems to me the rule changes are flowing NCAA-->NFHS--->ASA not the other way around

USSSA and others adopted NCAA rule changes faster than ASA which would make me tend to believe that other orgs look to NCAA for guidance, not ASA

[ronald]

You have some valid points, but the decision makers for the national team and what umpires will work those games comes from ASA. At least, that is what I think based on the info I have.

The women's "director" of umpiring for ASA (I know there is no such animal officially but there is unofficially, in my mind at least) was able to get two college umps working the college world series to use ASA mechanics in those college games with a phone call. You tell me who the boss is.. At the kentucky challenge cap, one ump was using the college strike call and that ump changed it during the game to the ASA strike call. Again, who is the NGB?

If working the college world series is your ultimate goal, then that cap is your boss. If you want to work the ultimate in softball, mens or womens, ASA is the boss cap. Of course, the two umps mentioned above decided that ASA was the governing body of softball.

When you go out on a field, know what cap to wear. If the head honchos from ASA are going to be at your game and you know that and you aspire to to do world championships, olympics, etc, you now know what hat to wear.

[IRISHMAFIA]

The NCAA only handles a single, gender-based game of softball. The NCAA also deals solely with "adults" and their rules specifially address what is a very narrow faction of the game of softball.

ASA is the most organized, financially sound, softball-exclusive organization in the country. The ASA addresses all levels as well as each and every aspect of all the games of softball for all ages, genders and divisions. They are also probably the most democratic softball organization in the world.

The NGB is determined by the USOC at the direction of the US Congress as put forth in the Ted Stevens Olympic Amateur Sports Act.

[topper]

Originally Posted by ronald

You have some valid points, but the decision makers for the national team and what umpires will work those games comes from ASA. At least, that is what I think based on the info I have.

The women's "director" of umpiring for ASA (I know there is no such animal officially but there is unofficially, in my mind at least) was able to get two college umps working the college world series to use ASA mechanics in those college games with a phone call. You tell me who the boss is.. At the kentucky challenge cap, one ump was using the college strike call and that ump changed it during the game to the ASA strike call. Again, who is the NGB?

If working the college world series is your ultimate goal, then that cap is your boss. If you want to work the ultimate in softball, mens or womens, ASA is the boss cap. Of course, the two umps mentioned above decided that ASA was the governing body of softball.

When you go out on a field, know what cap to wear. If the head honchos from ASA are going to be at your game and you know that and you aspire to to do world championships, olympics, etc, you now know what hat to wear.

I must have missed Snocatzdad's reference to umpire mechanics in the OP. I thought he was talking rules.

Please elaborate on your second paragraph. I'd love to hear it.

[topper]

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

The NGB is determined by the USOC at the direction of the US Congress as put forth in the Ted Stevens Olympic Amateur Sports Act.

There went the credibility.

[Skahtboi]

Originally Posted by ronald

At the kentucky challenge cap, one ump was using the college strike call and that ump changed it during the game to the ASA strike call. Again, who is the NGB?

What, exactly, is the "college strike call?" I have read many versions of SUIP manual, attended many clinics, and don't believe I have ever heard this referred to. Both say "hammer, 90 degrees or greater." So what, exactly, is the difference that you could notice? I use the same signal in NCAA, NJCAA, NFHS, and ASA....and I have never been dinged for it at any level.

[Dakota]

Originally Posted by topper

There went the credibility.

Regardless, the point is the NGB is a designation given by the national Olympic committee. They designate the sport association that they want to be the official body for that sport within that country. In the USA, that authority is delegated to the USOC by the Congress. For softball, the USOC has designated ASA. It's not like little Harry Reid or pompous Nancy Pelosi need to actually be involved, although if they thought there was a vote in it, I'm sure they would be.

[NCASAUmp]

Originally Posted by Skahtboi

What, exactly, is the "college strike call?" I have read many versions of SUIP manual, attended many clinics, and don't believe I have ever heard this referred to. Both say "hammer, 90 degrees or greater." So what, exactly, is the difference that you could notice? I use the same signal in NCAA, NJCAA, NFHS, and ASA....and I have never been dinged for it at any level.

Arm's more forward of the body instead of to the side.

[Skahtboi]

Originally Posted by NCASAUmp

Arm's more forward of the body instead of to the side.

Maybe that is the way that many do it, but that is not the way it is described on p.271 of the SUIP Manual. In both writing and clinics, it is taught the same, and as I have stated, mine is the same in all sactioning bodies.

[Skahtboi]

Originally Posted by Skahtboi

Maybe that is the way that many do it, but that is not the way it is described on p.271 of the SUIP Manual. In both writing and clinics, it is taught the same, and as I have stated, mine is the same in all sactioning bodies.

Of course, that being said, the college level does allow a little more individuality with mechanics/signals, within reason.

[topper]

Originally Posted by Dakota

Regardless, the point is the NGB is a designation given by the national Olympic committee. They designate the sport association that they want to be the official body for that sport within that country. In the USA, that authority is delegated to the USOC by the Congress. For softball, the USOC has designated ASA. It's not like little Harry Reid or pompous Nancy Pelosi need to actually be involved, although if they thought there was a vote in it, I'm sure they would be.

The Ted Stevens Olympic Amateur Sports Act states: "For any sport which is included on the program of the Olympic Games, the Paralympic Games, or the Pan-American Games,…". The Olympics already have, so if the other two Games drop softball, does ASA's NGB status become null and void?

[Dakota]

Originally Posted by topper

The Ted Stevens Olympic Amateur Sports Act states: "For any sport which is included on the program of the Olympic Games, the Paralympic Games, or the Pan-American Games,…". The Olympics already have, so if the other two Games drop softball, does ASA's NGB status become null and void?

You have too much time on your hands!

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by topper

The Ted Stevens Olympic Amateur Sports Act states: "For any sport which is included on the program of the Olympic Games, the Paralympic Games, or the Pan-American Games,…". The Olympics already have, so if the other two Games drop softball, does ASA's NGB status become null and void?

Not being in the Olympics doesn't mean a team is not an Olympic sport. That is, of course, unless you want to ignore facts that do not support your argument. BTW, obviously you overlooked the fact the the US still participates in the Pan-Am Games.

[topper]

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

Not being in the Olympics doesn't mean a team is not an Olympic sport. That is, of course, unless you want to ignore facts that do not support your argument.

What exactly is my argument in your opinion?

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

BTW, obviously you overlooked the fact the the US still participates in the Pan-Am Games.

Obvoiusly you overlooked this part of my post:

The Olympics already have, so if the other two Games drop softball, does ASA's NGB status become null and void?

What facts am I ignoring? What does the Act mean by "any sport which is included on the program of the Olympic Games"? Is softball still an Olympic sport even though it's not in the Games? Where can one gain this knowledge?

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by topper

What exactly is my argument in your opinion?

Not YOUR in particular, but your (generic) argument in general as I've already seen this discussed by folk who believe the Olympics are the Olympics and if you are not on the venue, you are not an Olympic Sport.

Obvoiusly you overlooked this part of my post:

You are absolutely correct, I misread the post an missed YOUR point...[/quote]

What facts am I ignoring? What does the Act mean by "any sport which is included on the program of the Olympic Games"? Is softball still an Olympic sport even though it's not in the Games? Where can one gain this knowledge?[/quote]

...but the answer is the same. A sport is an Olympic sport as long as the USOC says it is so and as long as the ISF is supporting the sport internationally, I don't believe it is going to be dropped as there are too many membership countries. Or the USOC, Don P. and Ron R. are just lying to us.

To be honest, I don't know if it is even worth the issue any longer. The Olympics has just been nothing, but a political volleyball for the past three decades or so and, IMO, has lost some of their luster. Then again, I am a cynic.