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-   -   What's the Call (https://forum.officiating.com/softball/51486-whats-call.html)

IRISHMAFIA Sat Feb 07, 2009 08:40am
What's the Call
 
ASA

Runner on 2B. Ball is hit to the shallow right field.

R1 misses 3B enroute to the plate, but realizes he will be put out and reverses direction. While attempting to return to 3B, R1 is obstructed and tagged out by F5.

Defense immediately appeals the runner missing 3B.

Skahtboi Sat Feb 07, 2009 09:04am
Well...since runners should be given an opportunity to complete their base running responsibilities, I guess we should hesistate to see what the runner does before awarding the base we thought they would have attained had the OBS not occurred. If they return to third, assume the retouch and then make your award (which for me would probably be the base they are currently standing on.) If they get up and scurry home, then honor the appeal.

I know with you there is a catch somewhere, so I will patiently wait and see what other answers are given.

MGKBLUE Sat Feb 07, 2009 01:20pm
Under rule supplement 36 the umpire will need to judge whether the runner committed another violation and that violation is being played upon.

The example given in the rule supplement is as follows:

A runner leaving second base too soon on a fly ball is returning after the ball is caught and is obstructed between second and thrid base. If the runner would not have made it back to second base prior to the throw arriving, the runner remains out.

Dakota Sat Feb 07, 2009 01:59pm
In the OP, the appeal came after the tag out. While not stated very clearly, the tag was apparently just a tag, not a live ball appeal.

DeputyUICHousto Sat Feb 07, 2009 05:21pm
Obstruction
 
Once an obstructed runner is played on and put out the ball is dead.

IRISHMAFIA Sat Feb 07, 2009 05:44pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dakota (Post 576639)
In the OP, the appeal came after the tag out. While not stated very clearly, the tag was apparently just a tag, not a live ball appeal.
Get new glasses and take the events in order offered :D

Dakota Sat Feb 07, 2009 07:19pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA (Post 576673)
Get new glasses and take the events in order offered :D
OK, but I guess I need something besides new glasses...
Quote:
Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA (Post 576561)
(1)R1 misses 3B enroute to the plate,
(2)but realizes he will be put out
(3)and reverses direction.
(4)While attempting to return to 3B, R1 is obstructed
(5)and tagged out by F5.
(6)Defense immediately appeals the runner missing 3B.
What in there implies the tag was a live ball appeal?

IRISHMAFIA Sun Feb 08, 2009 09:17am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dakota (Post 576688)
OK, but I guess I need something besides new glasses...
What in there implies the tag was a live ball appeal?
It doesn't and never meant to insinuate a live ball appeal. You are reading into it.

The status of the appeal is actually determined by the actions of defense and the manner in which the umpire addresses the play

pollywolly60 Sun Feb 08, 2009 01:51pm
On proper appeal of runner missing 3rd base, the runner is out.

( see RS 36 )

RKBUmp Sun Feb 08, 2009 02:16pm
If the umpire had indicated the delayed dead ball, immediately upon the tag it should be a dead ball situation and the runner who was obstructed awarded any base the umpire deemed they would have reached. In this case, he was headed back to 3rd when obstructed, so I would have awarded 3rd. I would not have recognized any appeal by the defense until the base had been awarded, and in this case the runner was returned to third, negating the missed base.

Dakota Sun Feb 08, 2009 03:19pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA (Post 576807)
It doesn't and never meant to insinuate a live ball appeal. You are reading into it.

The status of the appeal is actually determined by the actions of defense and the manner in which the umpire addresses the play
I never said it was a live ball appeal; I said it apparently was not, but the situation as stated left room for some doubt.

IRISHMAFIA Sun Feb 08, 2009 10:52pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dakota (Post 576870)
I never said it was a live ball appeal; I said it apparently was not,
Then why did you post this? You are the only one to mention it.

What in there implies the tag was a ball appeal? [/quote]

Quote:
but the situation as stated left room for some doubt.
I don't think so.

IRISHMAFIA Sun Feb 08, 2009 11:05pm
Quote:

Runner on 2B. Ball is hit to the shallow right field.

R1 misses 3B enroute to the plate, but realizes he will be put out and reverses direction. While attempting to return to 3B, R1 is obstructed and tagged out by F5.
DEAD BALL! Since the umpire has killed the play, all runners should be given the opportunity to complete their baserunning responsibilities, then make the appropriate awards.

In this case, I think it is obvious the runner was obstructed returning to 3B, so the award would most likely be 3B.

Quote:
Defense immediately appeals the runner missing 3B.
The appeal should not be accepted until the runner completes their running responsibilities. Since R1 is now standing on 3B, the appeal is not upheld.

Also, B2 would be awarded any bases the umpire believes the BR/R would have reached had there been no OBS.
<!-- / message -->

Dakota Mon Feb 09, 2009 12:36am
Quote:
Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA (Post 577006)
I don't think so.
Whatever, man. A tag can be a live ball appeal, and is not normally verbalized. My assumption was you were describing a dead ball appeal, but the "immediately" left room for doubt that the defense was explaining the tag. I only stated the doubt since you have been known to post trick questions before.

Skahtboi Mon Feb 09, 2009 09:20am
Quote:
Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA (Post 577009)
DEAD BALL! Since the umpire has killed the play, all runners should be given the opportunity to complete their baserunning responsibilities, then make the appropriate awards.

In this case, I think it is obvious the runner was obstructed returning to 3B, so the award would most likely be 3B.



The appeal should not be accepted until the runner completes their running responsibilities. Since R1 is now standing on 3B, the appeal is not upheld.

Also, B2 would be awarded any bases the umpire believes the BR/R would have reached had there been no OBS.
<!-- / message -->
Wow! For once there was no catch to the question! :eek:


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