The Official Forum - What are your thoughts.....

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Quote:

Originally Posted by drh898

I had a play at the plate in a tournament the other day. I'm the PU, bases are loaded, 2 out. Ball is hit back to pitcher, runner on 3rd is coming home. Pitcher is slow to react, runner slides feet first PAST home plate, missing it and then slaps her hand on it as she is at shoulder level with the plate. By the time she slaps the plate the ball has beaten her to the catcher who is standing on the plate. I call her out. Coach goes ballistic and do the parents seated behind me.

My partner comes over to me between innings and tells me that was a stupid call, that I should have called her safe and I would have not had an arguement from anyone as the only person who saw that she slide past the plate without touching it was me and maybe some guy behind the fence who was lined up with the 3rd base line. He then proceeds to tell me that calls should be made taking into account what the he thinks everyone else is seeing, in other words, don't make the tough calls that can be seen as controversial. I've talked with other umps about this and, to my surprise, this is quite common.

I don't go out of my way to look for trouble but I do call what I see. Tell me what you think about this.

Good Job, call what you see, see what you call.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve M

If this is what you saw, I agree. But, I don't see a runner using this kind of slide except when there is a tag play. Since it's not a tag play, I see the runner as just having missed the plate - so I need an appeal.

Nobody said the players are smart, maybe she didn't know the difference. :rolleyes: The more I think about it, I also have a problem with applying ASA 8.3.B. If parts of the runner's body were still in a position to tag a base without moving in a reversed manner, IMO, the runner has yet to "pass" the base.

However, if you want to apply intellect to the play, consider these from the OP:

The only way a player slides feet first and misses the plate is hook slide. Otherwise, other parts of the body would touch the plate prior to getting to the shoulder level. However, a hook slide is also used primarily to avoid a tag.

Since this was a force play, sliding would only slow the runner down. So, why is the player sliding? The catcher's location was mentioned as "standing on the plate". Well, that is a no brainer for a force out. However, since there was no mention of that being an issue in the play, I have to assume OBS was not a concern. However, if it was to avoid a collision, how is it she missed both the plate and the catcher unless the wide slide was intentional? I don't think I have ever seen a player, adult or youth, just out right miss a base on a slide

Quote:

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

I don't think I have ever seen a player, adult or youth, just out right miss a base on a slide

Are you sure? Not even in Coed Rec leagues in slow-pitch? ;)

The runner never passed the base without touching it, so there is no reason for an appeal by the defense since the play is, for all intents and purposes, not even over.

Thanks for restoring my faith in making the right call. If she had slid into home plate with her feet (which she did) but touched the plate with her foot she would have been safe. Instead she slid with her feet past the plate and when she was shoulder level with the plate slapped it with her hand. Not an appeal play as she was not fully past the plate nor did she have to come back to touch the plate.

I'm appalled at the "if the ball beats the runner, bang 'em" type of mentality that I come across sometimes. Or the ones who anticipate a call and don't wait to see the result before making the call. It looks so much better to look at the play, slow down, analyze what you saw then make the call.

Thanks for your input.

Quote:

Originally Posted by drh898

I'm appalled at the "if the ball beats the runner, bang 'em" type of mentality that I come across sometimes.

I certainly hope you are referring to a tag play, because on a force or attempt to retire the BR......

[QUOTE=drh898]...

My partner ... He then proceeds to tell me that calls should be made taking into account what the he thinks everyone else is seeing, in other words, don't make the tough calls that can be seen as controversial. ..QUOTE]

IMO this guy is weak and lacks integrity wrt umpiring

Quote:

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

I certainly hope you are referring to a tag play, because on a force or attempt to retire the BR......

I would hope he's referring to a tag play...

Of course, I'm refering to a tag play.