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Andy Thu Oct 18, 2007 04:22pm

brain teaser
 
This was sent out to our local group this week.

Assume JO game, ASA rules:

You (plate umpire) and your partner (base umpire) walk on to the field and see a player dressed differently (warm ups and a head scarf). It doesn't look gang related. ASA says that all players must dress alike and the rest of the team is in shorts and ball caps. What do you do?

The player's head scarf (not a dew rag or hankerchief), IS a part of her religious beliefs. So now how do you rule?

What if the young lady was wearing a dew rag and she was bald because of Chemotherapy?

Dakota Thu Oct 18, 2007 04:38pm

If non-Championship play, in all cases, let it ride. :)

Yeah, I know, cop out. ;)

3afan Thu Oct 18, 2007 04:59pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dakota
If non-Championship play, in all cases, let it ride. :)

Yeah, I know, cop out. ;)


not a cop out at all -- let 'em play!

JEL Thu Oct 18, 2007 05:19pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by 3afan
not a cop out at all -- let 'em play!


and if it is championship play, let the UIC make the ruling!

IRISHMAFIA Thu Oct 18, 2007 07:52pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by JEL
and if it is championship play, let the UIC make the ruling!

UIC would defer to the tournament director

Steve M Thu Oct 18, 2007 08:03pm

I agree, let them play

Several years ago, we had something similar to this with a player wearing something in honor of a number of her high school classmates and a couple of teammates - they had all died in a plane crash.
I uic'd that tournament and strongly suggested to the TD that he make the statement that "for this tournament, that patch is part of her uniform" and that's what was done.

IRISHMAFIA Thu Oct 18, 2007 09:03pm

Assume JO game, ASA Championship Play as a TD

[quote]You (plate umpire) and your partner (base umpire) walk on to the field and see a player dressed differently (warm ups and a head scarf). ASA says that all players must dress alike and the rest of the team is in shorts and ball caps. What do you do?[quote]

Unless the sweats are the same color scheme as the team uniform, they've got to go.

Quote:

It doesn't look gang related.
Don't care, nor relevant

Quote:


The player's head scarf (not a dew rag or hankerchief), IS a part of her religious beliefs. So now how do you rule?
If it is manufactured as headwear it is legal as long as it is the same color as the headwear her teammates are wearing and it is worn as a headband.

I know I'll hear about this one, but I really don't care about the player's religious beliefs. The player and parents voluntarily joined the team and signed an ASA roster. When they signed the roster, they agreed to play under the rules put forth by ASA.

They agreed to conform to the rules, not to expect the rules to conform to them. If it is that important to the player and her parents, they should convince the other players to conform to her by wearing similarly colored headwear or none at all which would alleviate any issue with the headwear.

Quote:

What if the young lady was wearing a dew rag and she was bald because of Chemotherapy?
The player can wear a cap and I really don't care why the player is bald. Again, the player signed the roster and agreed to play by the rules.


That is my "official" stance. In a game, I probably would not care unless there is an issue raised by an opponent, then everything reverts to the official stance.

Ref Ump Welsch Fri Oct 19, 2007 07:58am

If the headwear is religious related, I'm not going to force it off. I don't want a bounty on my head from the religious leaders! :eek:

As far as the chemotherapy example, she can wear a hat.

Dakota Fri Oct 19, 2007 10:30am

OK, somewhat more serious answer.

In anything below championship play, I will ignore all of the headwear violations such as these. If an issue is made of it by the opponent, I'll tell them to send for the TD / UIC, but we are continuing to play in the meantime. I may (if the coach has been a PITA) also let him know that if he want all non-playing rules called literally and by-the-book, he'd better make sure his team is squeaky clean, or be careful what you ask for.

In Championship play, I may allow the warmup pants (even if not alike in color / design, etc to the standard uniforms) if weather is a factor. If it is only modesty stemming from religious belief, not allowed unless they meet the requirements of being "like in color".

Headgear is another matter. A headband, visor, or cap may be worn, and if worn, must be worn "properly", and must be alike in color. There is no exception in headgear due to religion, attitude, cool-dude factor, or medical condition.

wadeintothem Sat Oct 20, 2007 09:26am

I wouldnt care unless there was some pressure to care. In a non protestable situation (ie most tournies & showcases), the pressure would have to be higher than the opposing teams coach.

Mountaineer Sat Oct 20, 2007 02:22pm

I think I would take some preventive measures by going to the opposing coach and heading off the problem. "Hey coach, they have a young lady going through chemo and she's wearing that scarf on her head to cover the hair loss. I told them I was OK with it but needed to check with you too."

At that point even he would would admit to being an a$$ if he said NO.

bigsig Sat Oct 20, 2007 02:38pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mountaineer
I think I would take some preventive measures by going to the opposing coach and heading off the problem. "Hey coach, they have a young lady going through chemo and she's wearing that scarf on her head to cover the hair loss. I told them I was OK with it but needed to check with you too."

At that point even he would would admit to being an a$$ if he said NO.

Great answer Larry. I had a HS game and noticed before game time that one team had two players with the same number. Went to the other coach, before the game started, and asked him if he wanted me to prevent her from playing. Coach said no problem. Whenever possible the best way to handle these is before they become an issue.

IamMatt Sun Oct 21, 2007 11:38am

Anyone know if a girl who is bald due to chemo is wearing a head scarf as a medical necessity or from vanity? I have seen older women who were bald from chemo without headscarves, and I can tell you from experience, just being bald does not require a head scarf under a baseball cap (don't ask me how I know!)

If it is a medical necessity, I would think let it go? Especially if it is small and made to cover the scalp rather than a long flowing scarf that does not have a medical purpose.

When she was 12U, my DD's team played against a team that had a girl who was bald because of chemo and wearing a head scarf under her cap. Our team chanted a lot and they started the "Hey first baseman, tie your shoe" chant and when they got to "Hey third baseman, fix your hair" it happened to be the girl with cancer playing 3rd. Our girls realized it as they were saying it and the chant sort of died off, but the other coach was sure we did it on purpose, complained to the ump, who warned us about USC. That team had it in for us the rest of the season.

IRISHMAFIA Sun Oct 21, 2007 02:46pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by IamMatt
When she was 12U, my DD's team played against a team that had a girl who was bald because of chemo and wearing a head scarf under her cap. Our team chanted a lot and they started the "Hey first baseman, tie your shoe" chant and when they got to "Hey third baseman, fix your hair" it happened to be the girl with cancer playing 3rd. Our girls realized it as they were saying it and the chant sort of died off, but the other coach was sure we did it on purpose, complained to the ump, who warned us about USC. That team had it in for us the rest of the season.

I wouldn't have waited that long. You cheer for your team, not against the opponent.

3afan Sun Oct 21, 2007 07:26pm

if its a girl going thru chemo then she wears it, no if ands or buts. i'm not asking the opposing coach either. she's playing, period. if its a tourny and the TD or UIC says no, then he can find another ump.

my mom is bald right now due to chemo - maybe its clouded my judgement - so be it.


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