Doctored Bats
 

I mentioned that I would bring this up in another thread, so here goes...

In one of the local leagues, we have a player who reportedly is getting his bats doctored. He'll buy a bat that's on the banned list for having too much "pop" (probably a Freak Plus), send it off to a bat doctor to have it stripped down and painted to look like a Freak 98, then use it in recreational games. One of our umpires knows the UPS driver who delivers to this player's private business (unrelated to softball), and the driver has told our umpire that this guy receives a shipment of about 10 bats early in the spring, ships them back out to somewhere else the next day. Then, a week or two later, the bats come back. During the games, when he hits one out, the batter on deck knows to grab his bat and put it in the dugout right away.

Believe me when I tell you that whoever is doctoring these bats is GOOD. Our own state UIC has looked at them (he's in the area), and not even he can tell if they're fake.

The question becomes: in a local league, what, if anything, can be done about this? He's playing in local co-ed recreational games, and many of the opposing players are very inexperienced. It's only a matter of time before someone gets seriously hurt, or even worse. Supposedly, these are Freak 98s, but all of us know better.

It has been stated by another forum member that bat manufacturers do not use primer on their bats, so no primer should be found if the bats' paint is cracking/peeling. Are there any other suggestions for spotting these doctored bats?

I'm glad to see ASA is taking a stand against this. They've already won one lawsuit (and smartly, at that!), and I'm sure more will follow.

Sounds like all you have is hearsay.

I would strongly advise against any kind of 'scratch' test to look for primer under the paint. About the only thing I can see is if the testimony of this UPS driver would convince the league to confiscate one of the allegedly doctored bats and have it tested to the ASA bat-performance standards. That's the only definitive solution that doesn't also damage the bat. But of course it costs money to run this test.

This is actually a serious allegation. If the player is guilty, he should be banned for life. But what if he really is just a good hitter? All of the 'evidence' presented is circumstantial at best.

The best suggestion I can give you is to treat those bats like a used car that had body work. Look for ANY blemish in the paint finish, look for any overspray or paint overrun on the endcaps or the grips. Make sure that the Freak logo is perfectly flush, and not a raised logo.

Finally, I believe that you have the final judgment in a pregame bat check. If you doubt that bat, simply state that it cannot be used that night "in your judgment". Force the local league to either support you, or overturn you. Either way, they then accept and assume all liability for the results.

I agree that it's all hearsay, and I know it's a very serious allegation. He's a very seasoned player, but you can tell that when he puts one out, it's the bat. The ball just flies well beyond what a Freak 98 should give him, and considering the actions of his teammates (grabbing the bat and almost hiding it once he puts one out), things are just adding up.

I'll talk with the other ump who knows the UPS driver, and I'll talk with my boss about it. If the report about the UPS driver story holds true, I (or my boss) will forward it on to the director of the league.

Any other tell-tale signs of a doctored bat that you've found?

So, he is spending $2000 - 3000 per year just to hit a few illegal home runs in a rec softball league?

Maybe the simplest way to handle this is to tell his wife! :D

Dakota:

Are you a divorce lawyer? :D

MTD, Sr.

Heh... Well, if he's buying 10 a year, he's probably selling them to buddies of his (further complicating the issue). He also owns his own business, so his wife, if the jerk even has one, probably doesn't even know.

Go here:

http://downloads.asasoftball.com/ump...ctoredBats.pdf

This is the format of the breakout given at the UIC clinic this year. It would be much better if you had someone who attended this session give accompanying (is that a word?) information, but this gives you a start.

Also, if it is a Miken, get the serial number off the questionable bat and call OKC. They will contact Miken and confirm the serial number belongs to that bat. If the number or any of the graphics on the bat are a decal, the bag most likely has been painted as Miken states they do not use decals.

Mike, that is exactly the kind of information I've been looking for. I very much appreciate you sending the link. If the Miken bat doesn't have the serial, would you say it's been doctored? Some can slip through the cracks during the manufacturing process.

And yes, "accompanying" is a word. ;)

If it does not have a serial number it should be considered doctored. I believe even Miken would tell you that. Also check to see if the serial number is a decal. If it is you got a doctored bat.

Two years ago I was working a Class C National in Hastings, NE. Several umpires, including myself, suspected a bat was doctored in just the way you described. It was pulled and sent to Oaklahoma City and found to repainted non-approved bat. I later heard that the owner/player was suspended from ASA play.

On a diffrent note where do you umpire at NCASAUmp? I work in the Charlotte area myself.

Jeff Merriman

Hmmm. Two other Tarheels on here? I, technically, am a transplated Tarheel. I was born and raised in Durham.

Transplated Husker. Born and raised in Lincoln, NE. Moved to Charlotte a little over a year ago. Love the Carolina lifestyle.

Jeff Merriman

No, Miken will tell you every bat has a serial number. If it doesn't, it is probably a painted bat.

BTW, please note that even a legal bat painted by anyone other than the manufacturer is an altered bat.

This may sound odd, but I would not be surprised if the UPS driver has some sort of privacy rules that he is/would be breaking if he discusses somebody's receipts and shipments without proper authorization.

I'm originally from Wisconsin, but moved to the Triangle area in 2000. I actually work in Durham, dodging bullets (and wishing I could carry concealed, but, alas, my job won't let me).

I'll pass the word around to my fellow "blues" in the area, especially the ones who call his games. We're tired of being accused of apathy, and I believe that most of us would love nothing more than to see this guy get his "just desserts." His general demeanor in every game is one of "let's see what I can get away with today."

Mike's PDF that he posted on here is very helpful. If any of you passed it over, you might want to rethink doing so. It provides some good info, and I definitely recommend reading it. Thanks, Mike!

Any other suggestions on spotting these doctored bats?

How about the barbecue???

:confused: :confused: :confused: :confused: :confused:

Has Durham changed that much in 20 years?

Durham's a bit rough in areas, many of which I try to stay away from. Can't speak for how things were back then, but things certainly aren't great now.

As for barbecue... Man... Speaking as a Wisconsinite...

I love it!

That was always true. However, there are a lot of nice places there as well. And you always have those Durham Bulls.

Give me a break! You guys want to put cheese on everything!

There's no cheese in BBQ!

Okay, so I was just going for the laugh, but to me, it is true, no cheese on ribs or pulled pork, my two favorites though some Carolinians can get a little to heavy on the vinegar sometimes!:)

I don't miss the cheese as much as I miss the beer and brats. ;)

Ribs and pulled pork? Stop it. I just ate, man!

Is the bat considered doctored if it has bar-b-que sauce on the handle? ;)

Not as long as it doesn't extend more than 16 inches up the handle. :D

Only in a men's Rec Slow-pitch.

Seriously, if in a league game an umpire suspects that a bat is alterd then just remove it. If the player doesn't like it go play somewhere else. Certainly none of the complexes around Indy want a player killed or seriously injured. That has already happen once a few years ago. A guy was killed, when hit in the neck pitching in a league game. If anyone is that big of a chode he needs to hit seeds in a coed game, that pretty much says it all.

Speaking ASA

That would be 15.0". And, I forgot, cannot be transferable to the ball :D

Unless it is a powdered BBQ resin.

True, but the sad thing is that the league's director is a spineless wimp who I seriously doubt would back us for removing a "suspected" bat (only based on hearsay) from a player's dugout. I think he tends to favor the players more than the umps.

You don't remove it for hearsay. You remove it for a reason.

Inspect the bat and determine what isn't right and then clearly state, "In my judgment, this bat does not meet the specification of Rule 3.1".

Be sure you have a valid issue/cause. Don't do it out of spite as that will kill ANY credibility an umpire has with the player or league. If the league director has a problem with your action, hand him/her your indicator and wish 'em "good luck". Don't worry, indicators are not that expensive and you can never have too many.;)

That's exactly why I haven't removed the bat. If I can't point to something specific on the bat and say, "that's bad," then all I have are suspicions.

I think I have 3 or 4 indicators, including one that could order its own drinks if it were human. ;)

No, it's not resin. It's rosin. ;)

For barbeque, it is resin! :cool:

Resin...........Rosin...........

Sonny's Bar-B-Que is the best in the Southeast. Great web site.

http://www.sonnysbbq.com/:)

You know you're a good tourney when they have a Sonny's near by.

You really don't want to start that thread again, do ya?

:D

For one of the best BBQ joints in America, this is the place to go.

Heads up ASA umps
 

Hey, ASA umps...

ASA released an updated list of non-approved bats yesterday. Go here for the list: http://www.softball.org/about/certified_equipment.asp

Darn it, if only I had checked yesterday. We approved a Worth Mutant last night, not knowing it had been banned earlier that day.

Anyone know of any "automatic notification" listservs for these kinds of things? Or am I looking at the closest thing to it right here? :)

Presently, this is it. However, this past winter ASA has openly noted that they are exploring the cost of initiating a connection with any umpires which would possibly include an e-mail address to which information like this could easily be disseminated to the troops.

The bat may be legal, but illegal . . .
 

I talked with a past president of ASA yesterday about banned bats. He was picking up a Miken Freak to have tested to see if it had been altered. There were tool marks on the end cap, and a pitcher had been struck in the face with a batted ball off of this bat and hospitalized. (He is o.k., but was in the hospital about two days.)
According to him, the bat was probably an Ultra that had been painted to look like a Freak by Miken. He theorized the bat was probably already made (but unpainted) when the Ultra was banned and Miken painted it to be a Freak so they could sell it to more customers. This particular bat was an old Miken Freak that had the 2000 stamp on it. I'm sure there are more out there like this one.
He also mentioned a bat (I can't remember which one) that he saw that tested at 97 mph brand new. They then rolled the bat on a roller and beat on it with mallets (accelerated break-in) and the bat then tested at 104 mph.
These are just a couple of things ASA is dealing with concerning altered and/or banned bats.

I have a hard time buying this theory. If Miken had painted the bat, there would be no markings on the bat or end cap, no need for it unless the player who owned the bat was not happy with how hot it already was. Miken has been one of the leaders in bat control, so I find it hard to believe they would jeopardize their standing and business by violating any agreement with the softball associations.

If this is found to be true, that is just the tip of the iceberg. Someone better have a load of money for the lawsuits by sanctioning bodies, leagues, teams and players and that would just be on the civil side. I would think there could possibly be criminal charges raised againt Miken and all associated companies.

I thought they were tool marks, as did the umpires and tournament director and UIC. He did not. Sorry for the confusion.

But this is just what he said. Anyway, he was sending the bat to Washington State today to have it tested. Of course, the bat has been around for 6-7 years; it has probably been broken in by now and will test faster than 98 mph.

bkbjones, while serving as a tournament UIC, has bribed two umpires with the only decent ribs in the Greater Seattle area that are not made at my house.

Interesting. How is E.T. doing?

Fine. I played 9 holes on Wednesday with him and a couple of other guys. He was hitting it left most of the day, but he still shot better than me.

I'll find out about the bat when I see him again.

I realize this is an old post, but I'm following up on it with new information.

We finally caught the S.O.B. I spotted the pry marks on the end cap (thanks, Mike, for posting that link to the ASA doctored bats PDF), and I told the team to get rid of the bat. I warned my PU that I had spotted an Easton Synergy SCN8 with pry marks. The owner of the bat put it back in his bag, but didn't tell anyone else I'd tossed it.

Later in the game, his teammate pulled out the bat, as it's one of his favorites (wonder why). With one hit, the end cap flew off, and upon examination, I found weights glued to the end cap.

We tossed the batter, but let the owner of the bat stay. I pondered tossing him as well, but decided against it. His teammates were staring, glaring, and cussing him up and down.

I'll admit I feel terrible for his coach, as I know she's a fine, upstanding coach and good member of the community. She's probably still fuming.

Now that made me chuckle--reminds me of a big leaguer breaking his bat and sending cork all over the field. Good job.

there is no way to tell for sure a bat is altered or doctored in ur words a painted bat is impossible to tell as far as it being a freak 98 i just sold my freak 98 that was hitting 330 ft bombs right out of the wrapper and its a true freak98 my friendone at the same store same time as i did and his is like hitting a canoe paddle all bats are different even the same model some are hot some are not further investigation needs to be done before accusations are made

Whaaaat????

1 - I wouldn't quite say that 330 ft hits are "bombs." I've seen some hits go over a 315 fence that were just beginning to start their descent back into the atmosphere. If it hadn't have been for the 40' tall trees behind the fence (and it hit the tops of those trees), the ball would have continued another 150-200 feet or so. Those are bombs. No, his bat wasn't juiced. He played on the local high school team that took the state championship.

2 - It's not impossible. It's just extremely difficult.

3 - Different bats will break in differently. If your friend is not getting much batting practice in, or if he doesn't rotate the bat on each hit, it will break in unevenly. Just a fact with composite bats.

4 - I'm sending you an old keyboard of mine. The punctuation keys work great. Please consider using them. :)

andy shows u really dont know much about bats yes there are the obvious alterations to bats that a monkey should be able to see im saying a painted bat to the naked eye would never rise suspicion unless u know about rue bat performance and there are very few out there that really know what an ultra 2 for instance is capable of 90% of the population could never swing it fast enough to see what a truly insane bat it is

I see you still haven't received my keyboard...

Is there a specific question that you'd like to ask us regarding doctored bats?

Dave:

I can see that you didn't have time to ship your keyboard to him yet! :rolleyes:

The Pony Express is galloping as fast as it can.

Hah!!! We posted at the same time. Great minds....blah, blah, blah.

steeve27,

I think what Andy was saying "what???" to was the fact that your posts are at best exhausting to read because of the lack of sentence structure, capitalization, punctuation...etc.

Lol sorry guys dint know i was being graded ! That 530ft shot u were talking about was hardball i assume?? remember ur talking like 5th level skydome at 530 ft. Brett Helmer and Jeff Hall distances using 120 mph bats

No, it was actually one of our local church league slow pitch softball games.

Not kidding. The kid has serious bat speed and technique.

Everyone's jaws hit the floor, including mine as I watched it soar from behind the second baseman.

Slo pitch??

Oh, that too, I thought he meant relevance. :rolleyes:

Here, Steve. You can use these:

. ? , . . . ? , . , :cool:

Yep. Slow pitch softball.

The entire field just froze and gazed at the ball, including the runners.

This kid's as honest as they come, too. His bat was 100% legit.

OK, since the subject has already been broached here, I'm not taking this thread too much more OT more than it already is. This idea that capitalization and punctuation rules exist only to get a 5th grade English grade is, well, juvenile.

As has already been said, the reason we have these rules is so the written language can be understood. It has nothing to do with "grades" and everything to do with communicating.

The person who won't use at least enough punctuation and capitalization to divide his writing into basic sentences is like the driver who changes lanes and cuts in front of another driver to avoid braking. He is forcing the driver he cut off to now brake. He has no problem inconveniencing others to avoid minor effort himself.

No, I have been watching players hit softballs over 400' for a while and I have a hard time believing there are bats with a 120 mph exit speed.

Then again, anyone who is truly a power hitter doesn't need a juiced bat, out of the wrapper or altered.

BTW, I know there are multilingual posters, but I'm not so sure anyone is fluent in jibberish. Maybe in the YSISF.