Poll: BU calling illegal pitch
 

In ASA, any umpire is permitted to call illegal pitches. The question is: how many of you actually do it when you're the BU?

You can in Fed too - it depends on what you are calling the IP for. As a PU, I cannot tell if they are crow hopping or leaping so that has to come from the BU. The BU cannot see things like the hands coming together or the feet in relation to the width of the pitching plate so that has to come from the PU.

I have called it but try to always get it when it really doesn't do any more damage than a ball on the batter. And - I try to get it early in the game.

As long as I make the PU aware I may call it, I do call it. Otherwise, it tends to cause confusion both with inexperienced PUs and the players. I usually call it if a pitcher doesn't start on the mound (I only call SP, not FP or Modified). I see a lot of lazy PUs let the pitcher walk up to the mound and pitch with no stop.

If you see the pitcher commit a foot, motion or contact violation, call it. Do not rule on the pitch itself.

When I see an illegal pitch, I call it - period. As BU, I've got the feet. As PU, I've got the hands. Why wouldn't I call an illegal pitch?

Man, some days it feels like I'm the only one in our org who calls it from the bases! I think a lot of umpires in our org either don't know they can call it or are too afraid to call it.

Y'all use a horse in SP??? :eek:

Yep! Makes things interesting.

Actually, we don't use horses here. Apparently, we only use sheep.

And here I would have guessed bulls. :cool:

I completely agree. It is no different that a runner circumventing the rules by leaving early on a pitch. Abusing the rules is abusing the rules and we are suppose to catch and penalize those that do so.

In my earlier years, I used to give the pitcher the benefit of the doubt, and 'warn' them that they are doing something illegal, assuming they had a bad habit or some other 'innocent' reason for doing what they were doing. I think I've become a little more cynical, after hearing about some pitching coaches teaching illegal acts 'because they don't call it anyway'.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NCASAUmp
I usually call it if a pitcher doesn't start on the mount


Y'all use a horse in SP???
__________________
Scott


Maybe she's going to give a sermon.

Bob

Realizing that I might start a fire-storm with this - I personally don't have a problem with that - to a point. It's called preventive officiating. I don't have a problem telling my catcher to go out and "remind" the pitcher to bring her hands together, or to keep both feet within the 24", etc. It doesn't hurt anyone and allows the game to go smoothly without coaches getting all pi$$y.

In rec leagues, if I see a pitcher breaking the rules, I often remind them between innings. Most of the pitchers in rec ball simply don't know, and most of the time, the batter isn't disadvantaged. But if I see a pitcher do it simply to see what they can get away with, then I hit 'em with it right away.

Tournies, on the other hand, are a different matter. I call it right away, no warning, no hesitation.

I agree. The only problem are the coaches mentioned at the end. Too many are starting to get to the point where they do not want an umpire to talk to their pitcher or catcher.

If you cannot talk to them, you cannot offer a heads up. Problem is these coaches have an ego the size of the outfield and cannot (or will not try to) understand what you are doing.

But you start calling IPs and see how much they like playing by the strict rule.

Learning about IPs
 

I worked my first tourney this past Saturday. I had a partner at BU who had worked a state semifinal HS game, and several NSA world series. In one of my games, a pitcher knelt down in the circle like Mark Fidrych used to do (but didn't talk to the dirt) and literally pulverized the dirt with the ball. I had to call IP and my partner didn't seem to have a problem with that.

In a later game with the same partner I had a girl start her pitch with her left foot toe touching about 6 inches behind the plate. I called IP (NSA rules). Coach came out, I told him about the rule, he was clueless and thanked me and told his F1to do it the right way. Between innings, partner told me that I should let him make those calls. Pitcher was legal for another inning or so, then reverted to the IPs and partner said nothing.

It was raining by the end of the game so we couldn't talk, but I guess the practice is to let some things go in lower level travel ball.

I say lower level because these were 12U kids who were not exactly elite level players.

I'm sure the next "senior" partner I get will want me to call everything by the book.

I'm getting the opinion that calling IPs is very "indivualistic" from one umpire to another.

Interestingly enough, we had a lights out pitcher here at a No. Va high school 2 years ago who only lost once all year, in the state championship game. My association buddies, said that she pitched illegal all year and that nobody would call it.

100% Agreement. I had a coach tell me once not to talk to his players when I was trying to tell the catcher to go correct something. Next pitch - IP . . . he came out mad and his catcher stepped in front of me and said "that's what he was trying to tell me to fix before you yelled at him!" He muttered something and went back to the dugout. She looked at me, smiled and said "Isn't part of my job to protect you? Besides, he's a jerk!"

Luckily, most coaches here don't mind you talking to their players. There are only about 30 softball only umps in my area and the top 10-15 are very well liked and respected by coaches, players and parents . . . and we have good relationships with them all. I was at a restaurant tonight with my kids and a player and her mom from a HS team came and sat down at our table and started giving me a good-natured hard time . . . very enjoyable. I'm glad we don't have a lot of coaches that are like you described, Mike.

Just one end.

Same thing here, my friend. Last year I was on vacation with my wife and 9 year old niece. We were in a restaurant in the middle of Montana when 5 or 6 girls from a 14U team over there, along with a couple of their moms, came into the restaurant and sat at a table just across from us.

A couple of the girls kept staring at me...which made my wife uncomfortable. I told her they were probably softball players trying to figure out where they knew me...and sure enough, they were. They finally figured it out, came over and chatted for a while. One of the moms and my wife hit it off really well...so well we ended up with a great supper at their house one night, along with one of their coaches and her husband.

I know that it's not all kittens and rainbows, BUT there are some good folks out there from "the other side."

Yes, I know what some or maybe all of you are thinking. I've been criticized MANY times for being waaaay too close to some folks from that other side. I was asked last year whether I was doing something I was doing for the good of the ASA JO Commissioner or for the good of SMSUA (our umpires' association). Long story...and three days later was bypass day, so it wasn't a very big deal after all.

However, I work very hard to let everyone know there is the relationship I might have with someone away from the ball park, but out on the field I am the umpire and they are the coach/player/whatever. I have had spirited discussions/arguments with some of these folks...but I am NOT their enemy.

I am NOT their adversary when I umpire. I hope fewer umpires look at their roles as something of an adversary...but I also know too many who believe just that.