Warmup pitches
 

Last night between innings, the first baseman on his way to his defensive position, stopped at the pitchers circle, picked up the ball and took two warm up pitches to the catcher. The pitcher, who was the last one out of the dugout came out and was ready to start the inning when the opposing team protested that the first baseman must deliver at least one pitch since he took the warm up pitches. I have reviewed the rule book and can find no reference to this. Direction please...... Thanks

If a coach goes out to warm up the pitcher while the catcher gets her gear on, does he have to catch a batter, too?

There is no such rule in ASA. Whose rules were you using?

From poking around on the baseball board occassionally, I believe that it's a rule in that sport - not sure about softball - possibly in FED? I don't see anything addressing the issue in the ASA book. And thank goodness for that, since it's common in leagues I work (SP) where a fielder other than the pitcher will grab the ball from near the PP and deliver an unlimited-type arc pitch on the way out to their position.

No, not there, either.

I don't know OBR well enough to say whether this is a BB rule. If it is, it may also be a LL softball rule.

it is a USSSA rule. At least it was on the test. The "new" pitcher must face one batter.

Bugg

IF the position change has not been reported to the PU, it didn't happen.

Are you sure? USSSA requires that a relief pitcher face at least one batter, but the crux of the question is, does a player tossing a couple of pitches to the catcher from the pitcher's plate between innings mean that player is now a relief pitcher?

In ASA SP...

Would these first 2 warmup pitches by F3 count towards the three total alotted the defense by rule 6 (SP) Section 8 - Warm Up Pitches, or do you still give F1 no more than 1 minute to complete no more than 3 additional warm up pitches of his own?

The way I was taught when I did SP many years ago (and it then dealt mostly with F1 coming in and throwng the ball to F6 overhand) was that the ball gets to leave SOMEONE'S hand 3 times; don't care who throws it, whom they throw it to, or how it is thrown. In the case of your question, one left. Without a reported change, I have no change.

Only in USSSA SP, not in FP.

According to the USSSA SP Rules Book, yes. The rule can be found under 5:3:B:4 and 5:3:d. It states:

"A player or a substitute shall be considered in the game...If a pitcher, when he occupies the pitcher's plate and delivers a practice pitch. (5:3:b:4)"

"Each pitcher whose name is entered on the original lineup, or who is announced as a substitute pitcher, or who takes a position on the pitcher's plate and delivers one practice pitch, must then pitch to the first batter facing him until that batter has completed his turn at bat, or the side has been retired. (5:3:d)"

Guys, let's not overanalyze this. ASA FP says nothing about someone other than the pitcher throwing the ball to the catcher from the mound. If a player other than the pitcher tosses a few to the catcher before the pitcher gets there, so what? Once the pitcher gets to the mound, she gets 3 pitches in 1 minute.

If the opposing coach complains, I'm telling him there's no rule that says a non-pitcher can't toss a ball to the catcher anywhere on the field.

Let's use a bit of common sense.

Right, especially "no rule that says a non-pitcher can't toss a ball to the catcher"; except technically the 1 minute starts with the previous third out, so the other fielder might use the whole time.

If it is FP as you indicated, it's five pitches in one minute.

Also, as the plate umpire my only concern is how many times the catcher receives the ball. I'm not the hall monitor making sure the right person is throwing them..

And, if we truly enforced the one minute, it would be rare that any pitcher ever received their alloted amount of pitches.

Most of our FP leagues have a 3 warmup pitch rule after the 1st inning (unless there is a pitcher change).

Oooops. Mike's right. It's 5 pitches in FP, 3 in SP. 1K pardons. From my experience, most pitchers are pretty territorial of the mound. No one else goes there.

Let the pitcher toss a few to get her arm loose, send it down, and call the batter up. In league play, I don't count. Tourneys with travel teams, I count. Seems like half the time, the catcher is still putting gear on.

I know this isn't proper mechanics, so don't blast me please. In league play, for the first inning, I tell the pitcher (both teams), let me know when you're ready. If it's 7 or 8 pitches, no one seems to mind.

I agree with Mike, one minute goes by and they haven't thrown their pitches. I'm not a hard-*** about it. I usually tell the catcher in the first inning "5 this inning and 3 every other inning". If they take a little longer when they come out, I tell them to send it on the first pitch. I've found that better pitchers in HS, and most in College and ASA just throw one or two and they are ready to play. It works for me.

I don't think we should tell them what to do, just like any other "coaching" comment or liability causation, if that's a concern. I believe the proper way is just to wait and say "one more" to the catcher after the fourth pitch, after they have taken too long, or when they are just messing around. I never tell the catcher to throw it down, or restrict the pitcher to less time or fewer pitches than in the rules.

Lest anyone get the wrong idea, I did say "technically" the minute starts with the third out, not that I ever count or enforce anally.

I try, especially in tournament play, to enforce the one minute/5 pitches rule to the letter. It keeps the kids playing more, rather than standing around burning up the clock, and it aides in keeping the games on time.

Since the minute does start when the 3rd out is made - I'm well within the timeframe when I tell them 3 and down. There's no way that can be construed as coaching. I'll say "send the next one" - sometimes they say, I'm not going down this inning - "okey dokey". Let's just play ball . . . I'm just trying to move the game along. Is it coaching, when after the 3rd out I say, "Hustle in, hustle out ladies!"?