Have you an out?

[WestMichBlue]

Originally Posted by NDblue

WMB,

You still don't have an out. Possession was not maintained when the tag was applied. The ball not touching the ground is not an issue here. The ball "popping" out as the tag was applied shows me that control was not maintained. It's like a 1B bobbling the ball on a force at first. No control = no out.

I disagree. A catch of a batted or fly ball has these control and voluntary release issues. We are not talking about a catch.

A force at any base requires the fielder have possession or control of the ball before the runner touches the base. If the ball pops out and the runner then touches the base before control is gained, then you have "safe."

Our situation is a tag of a runner. I think that you have an out the instant of the tag, as long as you do not lose the ball to the ground. And even there we have an issue on the amount of time that elasped after the tag and before the ball came out. (See old post referenced above.)

IMO, if the ball comes lose as a result of the contact and the defender regains control of the ball, even if the plate or bag is now touched by the runner, you have an out. How many times have you stood over a defender and said "show me the ball!" You don't care if she bobbled the ball, you are only insuring that it is not on or did not touch the ground.

So if you accept the premise that a bobbled ball that is captured before touching the ground results in an out, then the questions is what if the loose ball touches the runner? Is the runner part of the ground?

WMB