Interference or general play

[debeau]

Runner on 1st , batter hits a ball to 3rd who flicks it to shorstop for a force out .
Runner slides in to 2nd and takes the shortstop out as he is about to throw to 1st .
What do we have , if anything

[Dakota]

If it is a legal slide, nothing.

[umpharp]

its hard to say without seeing the play, but it sounds legal to me.

[SRW]

Originally posted by Dakota
If it is a legal slide, nothing.

Do you have a definition of an "illegal slide?" What's the penalty for that?

[WestMichBlue]

Do you have a definition of an "illegal slide?"

If NFHS game, then yes, we do.

NFHS: 2-52 Art 2. A slide is illegal if:
the runner uses a rolling or cross-body slide into the fielder;
the runner’s raised leg is higher than the fielder’s knee when the fielder is in a standing position;
the runner goes beyond the base and make contact with or alters the play of the fielder;
the runner slashes or kicks the fielder with either leg; or
the runner tries to injure the fielder.

What's the penalty for that?

8.6.13: the runner is out if the runner does not legally slide and causes illegal contact and/or alters the actions of the fielder in the immediate act of making a play on her. Runners are never required to slide but, if the runner elects to slide, the slide shall be legal.

But - if ASA, probably nothing.

WMB

[Skahtboi]

Originally posted by SRW

Do you have a definition of an "illegal slide?" What's the penalty for that?

As a matter of fact, we do. NFHS defines illegal slide in rule 2:52:2. For the penalty, see 8:6:13:Penalty.

[Skahtboi]

Originally posted by WestMichBlue
Do you have a definition of an "illegal slide?"

If NFHS game, then yes, we do.

NFHS: 2-52 Art 2. A slide is illegal if:
the runner uses a rolling or cross-body slide into the fielder;
the runner’s raised leg is higher than the fielder’s knee when the fielder is in a standing position;
the runner goes beyond the base and make contact with or alters the play of the fielder;
the runner slashes or kicks the fielder with either leg; or
the runner tries to injure the fielder.

What's the penalty for that?

8.6.13: the runner is out if the runner does not legally slide and causes illegal contact and/or alters the actions of the fielder in the immediate act of making a play on her. Runners are never required to slide but, if the runner elects to slide, the slide shall be legal.

But - if ASA, probably nothing.

WMB

We must have been posting at the same time! D'oh! (Actually, according to this 3 minutes separates the posts, but I was working and posting at the same time which accounts for the lag on my part.)

[bkbjones]

That's ok. I spent 76 minutes on the phone the other night talking about the same thing over and over and over and over and over...

So 2 times ain't so bad!

[debeau]

So this statement in the IFS Rule book and I believe you have a similar in ASA , is what .
"When after a runner has been declared out the runner interferes with a defensive plays oppurtunity to make a play on another runner the runner closest to home is also out "

No mention of slide .
Is this a case where the runner who is out must just disappear .

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally posted by debeau
So this statement in the IFS Rule book and I believe you have a similar in ASA , is what .
"When after a runner has been declared out the runner interferes with a defensive plays oppurtunity to make a play on another runner the runner closest to home is also out "

No mention of slide .
Is this a case where the runner who is out must just disappear .

The runner has a right to make every effort in an attempt to reach the base safely. As long as the "slide" is to the base and, in the umpire's judgment, not an attempt to interfere with the play, it is nothing.

[debeau]

Yours was the reply I was waiting for .
What we saw BU and PU was slightly different from what the coach saw and the player did .
It is important to note this is top mens ball.
The players who slide always are hitting the base and getting up to try for the next base .
We saw that the slide was legal, but the player was out on the force , the fielder leapt up so as not to get "damaged " and was in the act of throwing and moving forward when the runner was lifting up .
The fielder went over and was prevented from throwing .
Both of us had no problem in interference and in fact as I knew this was a big play and knew the players I was just past the pitching strip when I came up with the dead ball.
I was PU .

[WestMichBlue]

Debeau: So this statement in the IFS Rule book and I believe you have a similar in ASA , is what .
"When after a runner has been declared out the runner interferes with a defensive plays oppurtunity to make a play on another runner the runner closest to home is also out

This is a retired runner rule. By ISF rules your are correct in calling interference, and calling out the runner closest to home.

But you would not be correct under ASA rules (and NFHS). There interference by a retired runner must be intentional. Some would say that a pop-up slide was intentional, but as you described it, I don't see that as an intentional act to interfer or to break up a DP. I would have "no call."

WMB

[debeau]

I suppose I am at a big advantage as I know the players and how they play .
The pop up slide is certainly used to "inhibit" the fielder.
After all if they are out why pop up .

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally posted by debeau
Yours was the reply I was waiting for .
What we saw BU and PU was slightly different from what the coach saw and the player did .
It is important to note this is top mens ball.
The players who slide always are hitting the base and getting up to try for the next base .
We saw that the slide was legal, but the player was out on the force , the fielder leapt up so as not to get "damaged " and was in the act of throwing and moving forward when the runner was lifting up .
The fielder went over and was prevented from throwing .
Both of us had no problem in interference and in fact as I knew this was a big play and knew the players I was just past the pitching strip when I came up with the dead ball.
I was PU .

Now you are changing the scenario. If you had said it was a pop-up slide, and that is what caused the INT, I would have replied differently, but I think you knew that.

The slide is one thing, the pop-up is subsequent to and not part of the slide. INT all the way as you now have described it.

[SRW]

Originally posted by bkbjones
That's ok. I spent 76 minutes on the phone the other night talking about the same thing over and over and over and over and over...

So 2 times ain't so bad!

I'm still waiting for the memoirs to be released.