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RadDad2005 Wed Sep 07, 2005 05:15pm

awarded bases
 
I've been away from the game for a few years, the answer to this question seems obvious, but I have a question.
Bases loaded, bottom of 7th (last inning), score tied. Batter walks to score winning run, but batter in celebration does not touch first and leaves the playing field. The defense throws the ball to first, ump calls him out, run doesn't count and off to extra innings we go. Seems correct, but is the fact that the base is awarded change anything about the batters responsibility to touch first? The runner on third was also awarded home with what was supposed to be the winning run (not relevant I suppose, but...).
I seem to remember something about awarded bases that might differ, but it's been so many years, I just can't say. I did not see this incident, the story was related to me. I think the ump did the right thing, but did he? Thanks.

DNTXUM P Wed Sep 07, 2005 08:24pm

The out @ 1st is a force. If there were already 2 outs, then the call was correct. However if there were less than 2 outs then the run would score.

whaddayouknow Wed Sep 07, 2005 08:56pm

Quote:

Originally posted by DNTXUM P
The out @ 1st is a force. If there were already 2 outs, then the call was correct. However if there were less than 2 outs then the run would score.
Regarding less than 2 outs:

If the BR is called out for not touching first base, then would the runner at third be "awarded" home. In FP, I don't think it would matter since the ball would remain alive and advances other than BR would stand. However, in SP, with the ball being dead, would the the advances of the other base runners be allowed once the BR is called out?

RadDad2005 Wed Sep 07, 2005 10:11pm

can there be a force...
 
during a dead ball? Ball three, players are awarded the next base, ball is dead. If they want to make a play at first base, wouldn't the defense have to make the ball alive again?

whaddayouknow Wed Sep 07, 2005 11:50pm

I believe dead ball appeals are allowed in most softball organizations.

Also, if ball four was awarded and the BR went directly to the dugout without attempting to advance, I believe there is precedence for calling the them out immediately, without waiting for an appeal for a missed base.

However, on a game ending play, I'm betting most umpires would probably wait for the appeal.

IRISHMAFIA Thu Sep 08, 2005 06:50am

Re: awarded bases
 
Quote:

Originally posted by RadDad2005
I've been away from the game for a few years, the answer to this question seems obvious, but I have a question.
Bases loaded, bottom of 7th (last inning), score tied. Batter walks to score winning run, but batter in celebration does not touch first and leaves the playing field. The defense throws the ball to first, ump calls him out, run doesn't count and off to extra innings we go. Seems correct, but is the fact that the base is awarded change anything about the batters responsibility to touch first? The runner on third was also awarded home with what was supposed to be the winning run (not relevant I suppose, but...).
I seem to remember something about awarded bases that might differ, but it's been so many years, I just can't say. I did not see this incident, the story was related to me. I think the ump did the right thing, but did he? Thanks.

Speaking ASA and assuming two outs prior to the pitch.

The awarded base is to the batter only, not any active runners. Only runners forced to advance as a result of the walk are protected. However, when the out is made, the forced no longer exists, so those runners may still advance, but no run is permitted to score as the third out of the inning was the result of the BR not attaining 1B safely prior to being retired.


RadDad2005 Thu Sep 08, 2005 07:40am

"...but no run is permitted to score as the third out of the inning was the result of the BR not attaining 1B safely prior to being retired."


so if the run scored PRIOR to the putout at first, which I believe was the case here, the run should have counted?

shipwreck Thu Sep 08, 2005 08:33am

This is a "force out", not a "timing play", so at what "time" the runner from third scored, has no bearing on this play. Dave

CecilOne Thu Sep 08, 2005 08:59am

Isn't the key that the BR has to leave the playing field and be out for "abandoning"; with no "play" required?

CelticNHBlue Thu Sep 08, 2005 11:45am

Originally posted by IRISHMAFIA
...no run is permitted to score as the third out of the inning was the result of the BR not attaining 1B safely

The 'key' here is the fact that the batter did not attain first base safely (left the field of play and properly declared out). There is no relavance to the timeline of actions, no appeals necessary. The batter is out, the inning is over, continue playing...


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