What to do

[Big Kahuna]

Here's the play. I am on the plate, runner on second, bunt down the first base line. Pitcher charges and gets the ball in fair territory and makes the play to first. While this is going on, the runner from second, while rounding third misses the base by about 8 feet and scores. I see this happen. Defensive team comes out to appeal the runner missing third. Only problem is they go straight to the base umpire and he immediatly makes a safe signal without even looking at me. Everybody in the park, including me knows she missed the bag. Defensive coach leaves the field muttering under his breath, and since noone asked me, we play on. Should I have said something to the base umpire? This was a set play for the offense, and the only reason I knew to look for it is because I have seen it used in a baseball game. Offensive coach was surprised to find out in between innings that I had seen it, apparently they do it all the time and I am the first umpire who actually "caught" him at it.

[orioles35]

Pregame conference should take care of who has the appeal at what bag. Once they appealed to the base umpire, he should have indicated it was your call, not his.

[Rachel]

The plate umpire has the lead runner. That is your call. Your base umpire blew it. Since it is your call, conferencing with your base umpire and getting the call right is your responsibility.

The same goes for obstruction calls at 3rd. In a 2 umpire game the plate umpire needs to call fair/foul, look for the pulled foot, and see the lead runner round third. Tough job.

[Edited by Rachel on Aug 2nd, 2005 at 01:18 PM]

[WestMichiganBlue]

Coach's fault for going to the wrong umpire. But, really, how would he know.

Your partner is main culpret. Of course he would call safe; he was looking at 1B and never saw the runner. But the first words out of his mouth should have been "Not my call, Coach." And you should have told him so between innings.

Cutting the corner by 8'! This is not a mistake; this is cheating. And I think that you have to make it right. Call time and talk to partner and tell him that it was your call. If he agrees, then tell both coaches it is your call and your call is OUT.

WMB

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally posted by Big Kahuna
Here's the play. I am on the plate, runner on second, bunt down the first base line. Pitcher charges and gets the ball in fair territory and makes the play to first. While this is going on, the runner from second, while rounding third misses the base by about 8 feet and scores. I see this happen. Defensive team comes out to appeal the runner missing third. Only problem is they go straight to the base umpire and he immediatly makes a safe signal without even looking at me. Everybody in the park, including me knows she missed the bag. Defensive coach leaves the field muttering under his breath, and since noone asked me, we play on. Should I have said something to the base umpire? This was a set play for the offense, and the only reason I knew to look for it is because I have seen it used in a baseball game. Offensive coach was surprised to find out in between innings that I had seen it, apparently they do it all the time and I am the first umpire who actually "caught" him at it.

Speaking ASA

Who granted time for the coach? It should have been you. Since you saw the play, you probably knew what was coming.

With that knowledge, it might have been prudent to suspend play and follow up with, "What can I do for you, Coach?"

I know, hindsight being 20-20 makes posting that a bit easier, but sometimes umpires need to assert themselves.

Your partner screwed up, big time. However, the book (10.6.B) specifically states that you should not attempt to overturn your partner's decision unless asked. If your partner had half a brain, s/he would have looked to you before doing anything especially taking a call from you. Of course, the coach isn't too smart here, either. S/he probably should have asked your partner to check with you.

[CecilOne]

Unfortunately, this is part of why NFHS used require the umpire to call it w/o an appeal. Let's hope they don't hear about this.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally posted by CecilOne
Unfortunately, this is part of why NFHS used require the umpire to call it w/o an appeal. Let's hope they don't hear about this.

Sure would be nice to know to which part of this post you were referring.

The Fed used to have the automatic call by the umpire because NFHS thought it was too difficult for the players and coaches to grasp. After attending one of the MD Fed clinics the year it changed, I was dumbfounded to find that many of the Fed-only umpires were having just as difficult a time.

[CecilOne]

Originally posted by IRISHMAFIA

Sure would be nice to know to which part of this post you were referring.

The Fed used to have the automatic call by the umpire because NFHS thought it was too difficult for the players and coaches to grasp.

OK, I need to use quote more, as IM does, to make my responses clearer. In this case it wasn't any particular post, just the general problem caused by the play, and wasn't really a response to anyone but a side comment.

Originally posted by IRISHMAFIA
After attending one of the MD Fed clinics the year it changed, I was dumbfounded to find that many of the Fed-only umpires were having just as difficult a time.

Please don't generalize, most NFHS only and most umpires in general had no problem with that change or any other.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally posted by CecilOne

Please don't generalize, most NFHS only and most umpires in general had no problem with that change or any other.

Did not generalize. I was specific to this clinic. These Fed-only umpires spent more than 20 minutes with considerably simple questions, repeating them multiple times. Until I ran into the NFHS, I had never, NEVER heard of the automatic call as opposed to an appeal. I was well versed in appeals even at the age of 14 in 1966. It isn't brain surgery.