Trying to get a feel for when I should give time to runner who makes it safely to base on slide and then asks for time. Situation this evening involves only one runner on bases. The runner safely slides into 3B. Throw from center field veers off to the right of 3B. As soon as runner is on 3B, she raises her hand and asks for time. I call out time and then notice that the ball has gone past all fielders and is still rolling toward fence in foul territory. Should I have given time to the runner that quickly with no defensive player in control of the ball? As base ump, I really don't know the exact location of the ball because I am concentrating more on the play at 3B with the runner and F6--watching for obstruction or a no-slide collision, etc. With the runner calling time like that, she has only hurt herself by taking away her opportunity to score on the overthrow or bad throw to 3B.

Also, what if runner calls time after safely sliding into 3B and ball ends up going into dead ball area after time called. If it is appropriate for me to give her time in that situation with no one in control of the ball, I wouldn't give her the extra base or bases on the overthrow into dead ball area--time was called and granted before ball made it to dead ball area. Any thoughts.

[Edited by bluezebra on Jun 14th, 2005 at 03:15 AM]

You may not be concentrating on the ball when she REQUESTS time... but when she does, look around. Make sure play is, in fact, over. No runners with any possibility of moving. No ball rolling around, etc. THEN call time if warranted (softball is a live-ball sport. There's no need for time between every play. If runner truly needs time (lost her helmet, shoe untied, etc) grant it - but if not, there's no need to call time if these runners are requesting it after every advance.

Wait until the ball is in the circle. If R1 is still on the ground an F5 has the ball, holding the tag on R1, the play is not over yet.

R must stand up without breaking contact with the base if F is holding the tag.

F must successfully get the ball in the circle, as R may advance on an errant throw.

Don't kill the play unless there is an apprent serious injury. This way, you know where the ball is.

Don't grant TIME until the ball is in the circle and the runners have stopped, or DBT.

Stair-Climber,
I'm with bluezebra here. Wait until the ball is secure and no further activity is imminent.

As you get more and more games under your belt, all the action will slow down for you, and you'll have a broader and more clear awareness of all the actions on the field.
mick

I would consider this borderline over-officious.

Can you cite the part that requires a runner to be standing erect on a base before an umpire can kill the ball. If the play is over, it's over.

Just how long would you wait to kill the ball? What if the runner was content to remain prone until play was suspended? BTW, I did exactly that a few years back when I was playing. An umpire would not kill the ball, so I just laid back, still in contact with the base, pulled my hat over my face and told him I had all night. He eventually killed the ball, I got up and the game went on.

I would consider you to be borderline correct. >;-))

Quote:

Can you cite the part that requires a runner to be standing erect on a base before an umpire can kill the ball. If the play is over, it's over.

I didn't say I would kill the play when the basrunner was standing erect on the base.

Quote:

Just how long would you wait to kill the ball? What if the runner was content to remain prone until play was suspended? BTW, I did exactly that a few years back when I was playing. An umpire would not kill the ball, so I just laid back, still in contact with the base, pulled my hat over my face and told him I had all night. He eventually killed the ball, I got up and the game went on.

Not sure if I would've told that one Mike. lol

I don't know...if a baserunner is erect on a base, I think we have a different problem...

Longer than 4 hours requires immediate medical attention.

Gives a whole new meaning to "Getting up for the game"

Where do you find that requirement? I'm with Mike. An umpire who will not call TIME at the request of a runner in this situation is being OO.

Especially if it's a girl's game.

OH, my! Tell me you didn't go there! LOL! :D

MOM, they are at it again....

It's no wonder so many umps are blind.

I understand that time shouldn't be called until all action has stopped. Remember in my scenarion, I said that there was only one base runner on bases. If lone runner safely slides into 3B and is lying on her back on top of the base with F6 standing over her, nothing else is going to happen except maybe F6 trying to nudge runner off base when she attempts to stand up. In future, I will wait for someone on defense to control ball before granting time to runner; however, I will not necessarily wait until ball gets back to F1 in circle. Again, when runner asks for and receives time in this situation, she is only hurting herself by taking away her opportunity to go home if there is an overthrow to the base or to the pitcher. By granting time to runner, the defense is not being hurt or put at a disadvantage, well except for a possible cheap tag out if runner takes foot off base while trying to stand up after slide.

Also, I have noticed a significant increase this year from last year in coaches instructing runners to immediately call time as soon as they safely slide into base. I believe that many coaches believe that umps have to call time when runner asks for it.

[Edited by Stair-Climber on Jun 14th, 2005 at 03:24 PM]

Stair-Climber,
My guess is that the coaches instruct it, and that the coaches may believe it, because they are getting that call. ;)
mick

Stair-climber,

Just to clarify, my response was to the situation of a runner, on the ground, holding onto or lying on the base while a fielder holds a tag on the runner. The only "play" going on there is the fielder attempting to force the runner off the base. If play has ceased and the runner requests time in this situation, I grant it.

In your situation, you should wait until play has ceased. Just because the runner is only hurting themselves by asking for time while the defense is chasing down an overthrow, does not mean you should grant it. Live ball play is still on-going. You should not grant time. There is no urgency at any time for granting time. Make sure of the situation first.

Funny thing - last night I had a coach requesting time while his own runner was still making her way into 3rd. No play was being made on her, and the pitcher had the ball in the circle. I waited until she reached 3rd, then called TIME. The funny thing is that the coach must have thought I was either deaf (PC = hearing impaired), or ignoring him because he must have made his request at least 6 times.

Give a coach like that the hand. Tells him that you heard him, and tells him he must wait.

JFF - A basketball request
 

<I>Apology for "off sport" topic, but streamdoc's post made me do it.</I>

Few seconds left. Team B down by two with point guard dribbling into the lane.
Coach B requests time-out just before point guard scored.

Time-out granted and coach set up play with 1.2 seconds left. Miss. Game over.

mick

You're the moderator, you can add whatever, whenever, whyever, cause you're
<font size =4> DA M A N. </font>

Ouch! :eek:

I do not grant time unless I see a reason to grant it; a runner who can stand up without challenge, and dust herself off without any issue is not a reason to call time. A fielder who doesn't wish to throw the ball to the pitcher in the circle is not a reason (unless the ball is obviously wet). A coach wanting his players to do either of the above is not a valid reason. I will tell a player or a coach "no" to a request for time when I see no valid reason fo it; fastpitch isn't baseball or slow pitch, and killing the play without reason just isn't part of that game. If a coach requests time, he better have a valid reason, be making a substitution, or have a charged conference left. When a coach tells me "that's what we teach them to do", my response is "you better teach them something else".

A player prone on the ground and a fielder who won't take off the tag and end the play properly is a valid reason to call time. Wheb done properly, timely,and with obvious distain, most players learn not to hold the tag to that ridiculous end. A wet or unplayable ball is a valid reason; a dislodged base is a valid reason.

[Edited by AtlUmpSteve on Jun 14th, 2005 at 11:42 PM]

Especially if it's a women's game.

Bob

The original post offers an interesting question to me.
If BU grants time while the ball is still rolling and then the ball rolls into dead ball territory, are we awarding any base(s) for the overthrow into dead ball territory? Can it be a DBT award if time was already granted BEFORE the ball went into DBT. I would like to hear the opinions on this.
( Hope this is not considered thread hijacking since it WAS the poster's question ).

In answer to the original post, . . . . .
yes, you granted time too soon. I always look around and evaluate the capability of an additional play to occur before granting time to a runner who wants to brush off the dirt from the slide, adjust clothing, etc. Just because they request it, does not mean we have to grant it.

Anything that happens after you, for whatever reason, prematurely call time is irrelevant. It didn't happen. A live ball did not enter DBT - it was a DEAD ball entering DBT. No award.

mc,
thanks.
Kinda confirms what I thought was the case, but stranger things have happened.
I felt once time was called, the ball was already dead and anything after that was inconsequential ( talking about the ball finally ending up in DBT as a result of the throw ).
Appreciate the feedback.