Working Behind Pitcher

[Stair-Climber]

10 and under girls fast-pitch and working by myself. Pitcher on one team throws very hard (around 60 mph), but has no control. Catcher cannot catch her and only stops about one out of every six or seven pitches. The pitches that get by her are all over the place. Many of these pitches are hitting my shin guards, plate shoes, mask, and whizzing by my head. In two innings, I get hit on the arms and thigh and it hurts. Two opponents are hit very hard with pitches and it was fortunate that more girls were not hit. Coach of the pitcher is stubborn or oblivious or something and won't take her out of game or tell her pitcher to slow the pitches down. It was a bad situation. If I was coach of other team, I would have refused to put my girls out there in that danger. Anyway, when this girl came out to pitch in the third inning, I decided to take my mask off and work the game from behind the pitcher. Anyone out there disagree with what I did? Also, in an ASA sanctioned game, do I have the authority to remove a bad and dangerous pitcher from that position in order to protect opponents?

[mcrowder]

You don't have that authority.

And I can't imagine ever working a game with a real pitcher from behind the mound. You can't possibly see the zone from there. Coach-Pitch or 3-pitch are about the only good reasons to work from behind the pitcher.

60mph? From a 10-year old? I doubt it. Go get in a cage set at 60. But let's just say "very fast". Surely you've worked a 14U game with a horrible catcher. Those pitchers have to be faster than the one you were dealing with... Would you call that game from behind the pitcher?

[outathm]

I agree with MC. I cannot imagine a 10u throwing 60 MPH. I alsoif there agree with him in that if the players are doing the pitching then the only place to call the gaem and be fair is behind the plate. Out association works Coach pitch for one of our leagues and we stand in the SP spot for these. Everything else is behind the plate.

[Skahtboi]

I agree that there is no way a 10 year old was pitching anywhere near 60 mph. Most HS pitchers don't cross the 60 mph mark, and several college pitcher just pass that mark. If she is a really good, and I do mean really good, 10 year old pitcher, she might be hitting 40 mph.

In this situation, behind the catcher is the place for you to be. We have all taken our share of hits back there, it goes with the territory. However, our job is to adjudicate the game to the best of our abilities, and that would mean following the prescribed mechanics to get the best look at the play.

[AtlUmpSteve]

I agree in concept with everyone else. But, in reality, I have actually counciled an umpire who was nothing more than a backstop in one game to move away from the catcher and off to the side.

The 12U pitcher was throwing 50+, and her catcher set up behind the opposite batters box and held her glove back over the plate. If she touched 2 out of 3 pitches, it was a surprise. The coach wouldn't or couldn't move the catcher, and the PU was hit by almost 1 out of 3 pitches.

Sorry, we aren't there for that purpose, and I didn't care what message it sent, other than, if the catcher won't do her job, my umpires isn't there to stop every pitch with his body. Will he do a poor job of calling balls and strikes from there? Yes. Is that his fault? No. We are there to umpire the game, but the there has to be some minimum expectation.

[NSABlue]

Originally posted by AtlUmpSteve


Sorry, we aren't there for that purpose, and I didn't care what message it sent, other than, if the catcher won't do her job, my umpires isn't there to stop every pitch with his body. Will he do a poor job of calling balls and strikes from there? Yes. Is that his fault? No. We are there to umpire the game, but the there has to be some minimum expectation.

Well Said !!

[mcrowder]

I can see moving behind the catcher if the catcher refused to set up in the middle. You can probably call balls and strikes pretty well from there, especially with no catcher between you and the strikezone! Behind the pitcher is just not an option.

[wadeintothem]

Originally posted by Skahtboi
I agree that there is no way a 10 year old was pitching anywhere near 60 mph. Most HS pitchers don't cross the 60 mph mark, and several college pitcher just pass that mark. If she is a really good, and I do mean really good, 10 year old pitcher, she might be hitting 40 mph.

In this situation, behind the catcher is the place for you to be. We have all taken our share of hits back there, it goes with the territory. However, our job is to adjudicate the game to the best of our abilities, and that would mean following the prescribed mechanics to get the best look at the play.

A 14U girl hitting 40 is damn good..
If this 10U girl was hitting 60 she needs to be front page news.

[Stair-Climber]

A few comments about your responses.

Okay, she was probably throwing closer to 50 mph. Before the game, coaches from both teams made comments about her speed. One said close to 60 and the other said well over 50. I can tell you this, she threw as hard as any varsity high school pitcher that I have ever seen. She was a strong girl and big for 10 years old. Don't forget, I said she had almost no control, so it is not impossible for a big and strong 10 year old to throw that hard with no control.

For wadeintothem, she would probably make front page news if she had any control; remember, I said that she had no control.

I got hit plenty last year, especially with the 12 and under--fast pitcher and bad catcher. I even got a fractured hand from a pitch last year and a few very bad bruises to my inner thighs--those hurt. Even though I was getting hit a lot, I never even considered doing what I did last night. However, I have never been in a situation like I had yesterday. In two innings, I got hit hard in the hand, arm and thigh. I deflected about a dozen hard and direct pitches off of my equipment. I ducked from probably another dozen pitches that whizzed by my head. I missed a couple of late swings by batters because I was ducking from pitches that were coming at my head and a catcher who couldn't even get a glove on them. I have been around softball long enough to know that what I was experiencing was very unusual. After the second inning, I had had enough. Working behind the pitcher wasn't a problem calling balls and strikes; I wasn't too concerned that she would throw any strikes.

Thanks Atlumpsteve; we are not there to be the backstop for out of control pitchers. I enjoy umpiring, but it was completely unenjoyable working behind the plate with that girl pitching. If I have to stay behind the plate in that situation again, I will be giving up umpiring.


I believe it was irresponsible for her coach, which was her father, to allow her to pitch like that to other 10 and under girls. Is there anyone out there that would have considered not allowing this girl to pitch to 10 and under girls? She hit two girls with very hard pitches. One pitch was to the girl's knee, and I am surprised it didn't do serious damage. I felt bad for every girl that had to go up to the plate against her. Is there anyone out there that would have done something to protect those girls? As umpire, I felt a little responsibility to protect the girls.

[AlabamaBlue]

If you haven't called a game from behind a pitcher, give it a try some time in a preseason setting. You can see the strike zone MUCH better from there than you can from the traditional umpire position.

I've called quite a few allstar practice games (basicaly intersquad scimmages) where they wanted someone to call balls and strikes and that's about it. I worked from behind the mound and it's a much better view.

Whether or not I agree with the original poster, I don't know. I wouldn't do it in a real game just becuase of the perception issue. You may be able to see better from back there, but if everyone in the stands thinks you can't, then you're going to catch all kinds of crap.

[debeau]

Alabamablue.
You can see the strike zone better than from the traditional position?
Thats why every pitch thrown is a strike (according to the pitcher)
I think that the UMPs position behind the catcher or in "the slot" has been devoloped over many years and if there is a better way to call I am sure the powers that be would have done so .
To the original thread
You could have removed the pitcher as making a"travesty of the game " and I am sure there is a rule in ASA as to that .

[officialtony]

Having seen how crowded an infield gets with the ladies jamming in on bunt attempts and stolen bases and people running everywhere, I can't imagine doing anything from behind the pitchers plate. I rarely feel safe outside the perimeter as a Base Umpire. I feel like I would be in the way and impeding the abilities of the infielders.
What I would do . . .
is back up from the plate, stand up and make sure I did not get beaned or hit by any of those wild pitches and call everything a ball I wasn't sure about. When the coach complains ( and we all know he will ), explain that for your safety, since the pitcher has lost her control, you will be calling the game this way while she is on the pitchers plate. If he doesn't get the message, at least you will not get beat up anymore and he will probably lose the game, which will not make the pitchers teammates or parents very happy.
Certainly not according to the book, but your options are quite limited.
My humble opinion.

[AlabamaBlue]

Debeau, yes you can see better from back there I have called from both places. You never "lose" the low-outside corner from behind the mound.

I never stated that this was the better place to officiate the game from, only that it gave a better view of the strike zone.

[azbigdawg]

Disagree.. would never work a game from there again. No place is better than the slot for a great overall view of the zone.

[officialtony]

By the way, How do you watch for runners leaving bases early when you are behind the pitchers plate?
Just curious.
Another one of those thinigs you can't do when officiating from behind the pitchers plate.