Sticky situation at 1st

[mcrowder]

I'm having trouble visualizing this.

The ball is in foul territory. The BR is in fair territory. The throw is on-line toward F3 at first base. How in the world does this ball hit the BR?

If the ball is thrown from foul territory and is a quality throw straight toward first base, how could it cross into fair territory without being caught? Only way I can see this happening is if F3 is for some reason stretching toward the pitcher to catch this ball coming to him from foul ground and it hits the BR in their last step before hitting the base.

Honestly, this sounds like a non-quality throw to me.

[outathm]

Here it is as clear as I can make it.

F3 attempted to field a fair ball. Ball in fair territory, F3 in Foul Territory.

BR goes in to fair territory to avoid contact with F3 who has boobles the batted ball.

F3 picks up ball finnally and thows ball into back of the BR who is in fair territory up the line but not at the bag.

Ruled that BR avoided contact and hence was not guilty of interference.

Have been since told by another Blue I respect (ISF, NCAA D1) that should have called Obs on F3 and awarded BR 1B.

[Steve M]

OK, based on this description, I do not have any call - except probably safe at 1B. F3, while fielding the batted ball is the protected fielder, B-R must yield and F3 can not obstruct (unless something else done intentionally). F3's attempt to field the ball put B-R out of the running lane, so no interference on B-R unless B-R does something intentional.

[whiskers_ump]

Originally posted by outathm
Here it is as clear as I can make it.

F3 attempted to field a fair ball. Ball in fair territory, F3 in Foul Territory.

BR goes in to fair territory to avoid contact with F3 who has boobles the batted ball.

F3 picks up ball finnally and thows ball into back of the BR who is in fair territory up the line but not at the bag.

Ruled that BR avoided contact and hence was not guilty of interference.

Have been since told by another Blue I respect (ISF, NCAA D1) that should have called Obs on F3 and awarded BR 1B.

How could anyone determine that OBS has occured on this?
Just curious.

[JEL]

Originally posted by whiskers_ump

How could anyone determine that OBS has occured on this?
Just curious.

While the fielder has the right to field a batted ball, OBS can occur when she is chasing a bobbled ball. This is an interp I heard at a recent clinic. It would be a huge stretch for me to call OBS, but I guess it could be possible. In this scenario I still see the BR moving to allow the fielder access, and I can not see OBS, nor INT.

[outathm]

The Blue I talked to said once she had attempted to field the ball and booted it she had to give ground to the Off player. I'm not all that clear on the reasoning here either, but I eanted to throw all the imput I;ve recieved out there. I am gathering that the right call is BR at first as R2. This is where we ended up, but we had a mad coach (as if that is a surprise).

As a PS I might as well add that about three innings later he told me that he wanted to protest the game. I told him that he had until the next pitch Legal or Ill. to do so, he said, "Well, that must be some new NCAA thing." It was all I could do to not laugh.

Other than this incident we had a fairly smooth game.

[JEL]

Originally posted by mcrowder
I'm having trouble visualizing this.

The ball is in foul territory. The BR is in fair territory. The throw is on-line toward F3 at first base. How in the world does this ball hit the BR?

If the ball is thrown from foul territory and is a quality throw straight toward first base, how could it cross into fair territory without being caught? Only way I can see this happening is if F3 is for some reason stretching toward the pitcher to catch this ball coming to him from foul ground and it hits the BR in their last step before hitting the base.

Honestly, this sounds like a non-quality throw to me.

Sounds that way to me also mcrowder, but if F3 was leading the throw to F4 coming in to cover it could be possible. I rather think that F3 had been coached to "plunk" the runner.

[outathm]

F3 was throwing the finally fielded ball to F4

[debeau]

To JFL
This seems to be the case and is the point NZUMPIRE makes as to Merle Butlers comment the runner being the "duck in the pond ".
Where in the rules does it state the running lane reverses when a throw is from foul territory ?
Its sensible but no rule yet .

[mcrowder]

I see now - the whole play was right on the baseline - got it now.

I don't see OBS unless F3 did something egregious, but I surely don't see INT either. (As mentioned above by Mike, I've been told in clinics that when the ball is in foul territory, the running lane extends 3 feet on the fair side as well).

[rhsc]

Originally posted by mcrowder
I see now - the whole play was right on the baseline - got it now.

I don't see OBS unless F3 did something egregious, but I surely don't see INT either. (As mentioned above by Mike, I've been told in clinics that when the ball is in foul territory, the running lane extends 3 feet on the fair side as well).

All that said, what do you do. See, I gotta know what you guys call so I can stop looking sike an idiot on the field.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally posted by outathm
The Blue I talked to said once she had attempted to field the ball and booted it she had to give ground to the Off player.

That would be a reversal of what I've witnessed in past NCAA clinics. In those, they wanted the fielder protected forever.

In one of the first NCAA clinics I attended, there was a given scenario that had F5 have the ball run up her arm and behind her into foul territory. The fielder dove backwards for the ball and into a runner retreating to 3B. The prescribed call was INT on the runner.

Personally, I would hope they moved off that dime, but not to the extent as is stated above. It seems to me the status of a batted ball remains a batted ball until it is caught/fielded or enters dead-ball territory.

[DownTownTonyBrown]

Originally posted by IRISHMAFIA
That would be a reversal of what I've witnessed in past NCAA clinics. In those, they wanted the fielder protected forever.

In one of the first NCAA clinics I attended, there was a given scenario that had F5 have the ball run up her arm and behind her into foul territory. The fielder dove backwards for the ball and into a runner retreating to 3B. The prescribed call was INT on the runner.

In my mind that would be a terrible call. Defense boots their opportunity to make a play and incidentally then bumps the runner legally returning to 3rd so they won't be tagged. Umpire calls "Time. Interference. Runner is out."

Mike, I'll bet you've never made that call. Holy Smokes! That would create a brouhaha.

Only if interference were intentionally committed by the runner would I have anything besides a fielding error.

Check NFHS casebook play 2.21.1 Situation C. F2 fumbles a third strike into the batter's path. Batter unintentionally kicks ball away from F2. I would say this is even a little more serious than a minor/secondary collision caused by the fielder. Correct ruling from the casebook is no-call - live ball.

[DownTownTonyBrown]

As I was putting away my reference material I noticed it was a baseball rulebook and casebook. Sorry!

There is no such situation in the softball casebook. But I would still rule the same... I think.

Interference is generally called when the offense is in the wrong place (outside the running lane for a regular play from F2 to F3 from inside the diamond), OR they intentionally interfere. To call a runner out because a fielder jumps into them after booting a play is just not right.

[DownTownTonyBrown]

Tony's got a baseball book?! What the heck is he doing lurking in this forum?

There goes all my credibility on this board. Dang it!