Mike: "Now you are going to have to define the game you are playing"

ASA or NFHS FP Softball.

MA SB UMP: "All runners in this sitch are "entitled to advance without liability to be put out..."

Only to the base they were forced to by a walked batter. In my situation runners reach that base - and then go past the base - and are put out before the first runner touches home.

The question: "Is an awarded run scored instantly? Or can it be negated by rules that normally apply to runners that must earn their way home?"

WMB

Re: Re: BOB - BL
 

Not sure how many times this has to be answered. No, the run does not score.

Re: Re: Re: BOB - BL
 

Apparently as many times as it keeps being asked. My Q that you quote was not because I was unsure; it was intended as a rhetorical back to MA Softball Ump who cited a rule & said that, yes, the run would score (at least that is what I understood him to be saying). Note my first answer in this thread.

Fair enough.

:)

Lets reach a little. Take the bases loaded situation and the batter walks. Say the runners are off with the pitch and it is ball four. R1 at third did not run, R2 did and over runs 3rd and is tagged out. Is R1 in jeopardy to be put out now that the force is removed by R2 being tagged out? Hmmm?

23,

Not if you are using the originally posted situation. There were already
two outs. :)

I'm just adding a wrinkle to the situation by saying there is only one out, is the runner from third in jeopardy to be put out?

I had a hard time finding these answers in a case book and had to go back to one from the early 90's to reference any situation and the answer might surprise some of you out there.

No,not from the original scenerio.
Why would it matter how many outs there are? That would only matter as to whether the game is over.
Referencing the 90's, you got way too much time on your hands. Dont leae us hangin though, tell us what it says.

"Why would it matter how many outs there are? "

Actually it is a good question. If the force is off, is R1 still entitled to free passage home? Or can R1 be tagged out walking to home plate?

WMB

[QUOTE]Originally posted by WestMichBlue
[B]Mike: "Now you are going to have to define the game you are playing"

ASA or NFHS FP Softball.

MA SB UMP: "All runners in this sitch are "entitled to advance without liability to be put out..."
It seems to me the most important part of that rule here would be "Any runner affected is entitled to one base and may advance at their own risk". Once they pass the base they can be put out.

Sorry .... I kinda messed up the quote. I think you can figure it out. Brian

Answer is,

In the original scenerio, according to the only case book which references the situation, the run would still count. It is from the 92 baseball case book, when cross referencing the wording in the rule books the wording reads basicaly the same. The key word is ENTITLED, that means guaranteed regardless of what happens. AT the time of the pitch sets the stage and at the time of the pitch bases were loaded so every one is entitled to the next base. The ball does remain live and the 3rd out was made but not until after the pitch had occured. If the runner fails to touch home you may however get a fourth out on appeal.

The second scenerio, no the runner is not liable to be put out because at the time of the pitch the bases were loaded and with ball 4 came the entitlement to home.