I know a guy who scored 800 on the SAT math (40 years ago, when it was much harder), fell just short of 800 on the English SAT and the English achievement, and was graduated from a US News & World Report "Top 25" college.

He has a remarkable vocabulary and facility with words. University professors come to him for advice regarding articles they are submitting to peer-reviewed journals.

He was also a pretty good ballplayer.

Remarkably, however, though he has read ASA's DEFO rule over and over, he claims that he still does not understand it.

A helpful hint
 

Tell him to go to Emily's website and download the slide show...then come back if he has any more questions.

I know a guy who scored 800 on the SAT math (40 years ago, when it was much harder)

Math or the SAT test? 2+2 was 4, forty years ago and it still is today. I think.

Sorry, I'm being silly, but I too have diffficuly wrapping my head around the DEFO rules.

Kevin

OK, guys, you know this is coming...
;)
Also check out the handouts on Softball Umpires.

And rightfully mention it you should.

Tom,

Have been unable to open the Understanding Rules for DP/FLEX. Keeps saying error on page. Opened Cecil's though.

Are both yours and Steve's versions on the other heading?

[QUOTE]Originally posted by whiskers_ump

Quote:

Have been unable to open the Understanding Rules for DP/FLEX. Keeps saying error on page.

Worked just fine for me. I just went and tried it.

Steve's two articles and my article are different kinds of postings than Cecil's. I put Cecil's up as a simple web page. This means any web browser can open it. Steve's NCAA writeup is a Microsoft Excel spreadsheet. Steve's DH v. DP comparison and my "Understanding..." article are both Microsoft Word documents. For these last three, then, the browser will open a pop-up window for you to download the articles. If you have an agressive pop-up blocker active, it may require you to tell the blocker "open this one anyway" (which for my blocker is holding down the CTRL key while clicking on the link - but then, my blocker doesn't block these popups anyway).

HTH.

Tom,

I still cannot get into the Understanding DP/FLEX.

I cleaned cookies,
used ctrl key when attempting, but nothing works.
Soooo, must be me, cause others can get it.

Thanks

Try it now, Glen. I've posted two other formats for those files - pdf (for the Adobe reader) and htm (web page). You should be able to make one of them work.

Thanks Tom..works great. Need copies for the seven new
NFHS umpires we got this year.

The only thing I have to say about your friend is, "so what!"

He has a high IQ and attended a "top 25" college. Oooooohh, should I be impressed? Give me a break! My cousin is working on his 20-something year in college as a professional student and does very well for himself, on campus. Take him out into the real world and he is totally useless.

I know folks working on their PhD's that need a pencil and paper to subtract 77 from 100 and still not get it the first time.

I'm sorry, but testing intelligent and being smart are not necessarily synonymous and in the real world the distance between the two can be as vast as it may be narrow.


Like it or not, and you tell us every year about the faults of this publication, it is not produced to satisfy literary purist or win any awards. It's purpose is to maintain a structured set of rules by which the ASA-sanctioned game is to be governed. The rules themselves demand the book be considered as a whole, not by chapter and verse.

One thing is for sure, maybe your buddy should avoid umpiring softball :)

JMHO,

<b>The only thing I have to say about your friend is, "so what!"

He has a high IQ and attended a "top 25" college. Oooooohh, should I be impressed?</b>

No. Many people test high and attend good colleges. You and I undoubtedly know quite a few. We may have done the same things ourselves. I cited those things simply as evidence that the guy is not stupid.

<b>Give me a break! My cousin is working on his 20-something year in college as a professional student and does very well for himself, on campus. Take him out into the real world and he is totally useless.

I know folks working on their PhD's that need a pencil and paper to subtract 77 from 100 and still not get it the first time.</b>

Yes, there are those people. Bell Labs had a theoretical physicist who made all kinds of important discoveries and even won a Nobel prize, but they had to have someone travel with him so he wouldn't get lost in the airport. They had another genius who, when he walked, always did so backwards. They had to tell him it was time to go home, or he'd work night and day, unaware of the time. And supposedly Einstein used to forget where he lived and the police would drive him home. My friend is not like that. The U.S. Air Force would not have let him fly B-52s if he was. Incidentally, the only reason I know his test scores is that I went to school with him and saw the postcard when it came from ETS. I've never known him to brag about his achievements, show off his knowledge, or disparage the comments and opinions of people who know less than he does.

And he freely admits his inferiority when it comes to grasping the DP/FLEX whatever rule.

<b>I'm sorry, but testing intelligent and being smart are not necessarily synonymous and in the real world the distance between the two can be as vast as it may be narrow.</b>

It is impossible to score high on tests accidently. Nobody who scores high is stupid. However, such a person can be brilliant in certain areas and remarkably weak in others. But these people are the exception, not the rule.

As for the ASA rule book, I don't expect it to be well written. But it shouldn't be so <i>badly</i> written.

Perhaps I should turn in my indicator...missed two questions on my ACT and six on my SAT...actually netted money by going to college...but that was years ago.

However, I do understand the whole FLEX deal, as well as the other stuff in the rule book, and understand that it ain't necessarily what you know that counts as much as the common sense application of those rules. To carry it a step farther, I know of "ump nerds" who miss questions on purpose on tests just to try to be better accepted by our umpiring peers.

I also understand that a lotta nerds (and yes, I am one) don't have a lot of common sense -- but let's don't paint them all with that broad brush. If it's the fellow from Bell Labs who I figure y'all are talkin about, he is just one of a few million who suffer from some form of Asperger's Syndrome, which is a form of autism.

I could go on, but don't want to beat a deceased eqqus...

Never said or even insinuated he was stupid.

Quote:

<b> I know folks working on their PhD's that need a pencil and paper to subtract 77 from 100 and still not get it the first time.</b> Yes, there are those people. Bell Labs had a theoretical physicist who made all kinds of important discoveries and even won a Nobel prize, but they had to have someone travel with him so he wouldn't get lost in the airport. They had another genius who, when he walked, always did so backwards. They had to tell him it was time to go home, or he'd work night and day, unaware of the time. And supposedly Einstein used to forget where he lived and the police would drive him home. My friend is not like that. The U.S. Air Force would not have let him fly B-52s if he was.

Bad analogy. I use to work a store in P'cola across the street from an appartment complex where a handful of the Blue Angels lived and were regular customers. They drive jets at an unbelievable speed and very close range, but there were a couple of guys I wouldn't trust figuring out the check at the restaurant.

Quote:

<b>I'm sorry, but testing intelligent and being smart are not necessarily synonymous and in the real world the distance between the two can be as vast as it may be narrow.</b> It is impossible to score high on tests accidently. Nobody who scores high is stupid. However, such a person can be brilliant in certain areas and remarkably weak in others. But these people are the exception, not the rule. As for the ASA rule book, I don't expect it to be well written. But it shouldn't be so <i>badly</i> written.

Scoring high on a test means one thing, the individual tests well. Intelligent, most likely, but I know people who couldn't pass a test if their life depended on it and they were more intelligent than a couple of Rhodies I know. Wasn't it the Bandit that said, "It all depends where you are standing as to how intelligent you are"?

Meanwhile, I don't believe the ASA rule book is that poorly written. I have no problem with it, but then again, maybe that's because I'm not a literary person.

I know the game and the rules. I utilize that knowledge with the schools, clinics and experience I have attained over the years and use that in conjunction with the rule book to work the game.

The rule book is NOT a "How to" book you can pick up at Home Depot and go out and work a softball game. I suggust your friend attend a few clinics and then reread Rule 4, in whole. Then POE 15 and then Rule 4 again. See if he gets it then.

Mike

Yep. Most people don't realize that Ol' Uncle Albert was a tequila man.

The ASA rule book has its share of funny sentence structures, misplaced sub-rules, errors in grammar, and other assorted problems. And, I've been known to poke fun at them from time-to-time, and even once made a serious suggestion that the ASA rule book could benefit from some professional editing.

I can imagine a senior editor at Simon & Schuster going into red-faced rant mode if a reference book with so many errors made it out with Simon & Schuster's name on the title page.

None of which is any criticism of ASA as a softball organization. It is criticism of ASA as a book publisher.

None of which has anything whatsoever to do with the DP/FLEX rule, either. The rule is reasonably well-written. The issue with the rule is the numerous scenarios that came come up in a real game where the rule may need to be applied.

So, someone who has an issue with their own ability to deal with multi-variable problems rather than an issue with how the rule is written. I hope your friend is in some relatively simple job, such as teaching young minds the English language. ;)

Re: A helpful hint
 

What is the link or URL to "Emily's website", please?

Re: Re: A helpful hint
 

http://www.cactusumpires.com/

Welcome to the board.

There is some truth in this.

Let's face it, way too much time is spent on understanding the FLEX/DP rule. It has <b>always</b> been difficult to digest.

It's much more complex than any rule having to do with a Designated Hitter or an Extra Player. Pages and pages could be written on this rule alone. All the possibilities ... the combinations and permutations, boggle the mind. Some say that this is the rules STRENGTH. I disagree - I think it's the rule's <b>weakness</b>. Any rule that requires this much attention is flawed, in my opinion.

We have umpires in the softball community who are "experts" on this rule. Whenever anybody asks any difficult questions, we refer them to the experts. There are DP/FLEX experts? Where are all the obstruction experts? Where are the illegal pitch experts? There are none - because most everybody can speak intelligently on those topics. They're comfortable talking about obstruction and illegal pitches. Ask a tough question about DP/FLEX and what do you get? Links!

Sure, most of us all understand the rule quite well ... but that's what we do! We're umpires! And, even with that, we still spend an inordinate amount of time with it. We find loopholes. We ask for clarifications. We seek interpretations. We analyze various substitution scenarios. Sometimes we agree. Sometimes we disagree. And then we start all over again.

It begs the question: Should it really be this complicated?

And, let's face it - it IS complicated!

It's not about whether YOU understand it. It's about why so many OTHERS don't.

Is EVERYBODY stupid -or- perhaps, is the rule a little more complicated than it needs to be?

The Extra Hitter Rule, which is popular in so many other system of rules, would accomplish many of the same objectives that are achieved with the DP/FLEX. The only main difference is that there would acutally be TEN hitters. Any 9 can take the field at any time.

Simple. Straight forward. Easy to understand. No complicated substitution scenarios. No going from 9 to 10, then 10 to 9, then back to 10.

The DP/FLEX can be a powerful tool *if* you understand all the in's and out's. The problem is, how many coaches know these in's and out's? And, should a rule be so complicated that there are a "few" that can gain an advantage over the "many" who simply don't get it? And is that because the "many" are all stupid people?

I don't mean to be bashing the DP/FLEX rule. I think I understand it well enough. I don't have a problem with it. But, I'm not blinded by the fact that so many people simply DON'T get it. It's hard to ignore that. The question that should be asked is: Why?

David Emerling
Memphis, TN

[Edited by David Emerling on Jan 28th, 2005 at 10:19 AM]

David Emerling
 

You seem to be wanting to ruin a good discussion by showing up with a clear, thought out and logical post. Cut it out. LOL Receiving a shift in perspective is one of funnest things I have happen to me .

Hmmm... asked and answeredUmpiring IS dealing with multi-variable problems. There is no doubt some umpires muddle through with only a fair knowledge of the basic rules and just ignore everything else. I know an umpire who refuses to call the IFR because he can't keep it straight. Wonderful.

I also challenge your assertion that Wow! Are you new to these boards?

So you like the slowpitch EH (EP) rule. Fine. We could all just adopt the rec-ball "bat-the-roster-unlimited-defensive-substitution" rule, too. Real simple, then. No need for even a line up card except for BOO.

Why don't we just adopt the USFA's rule book and declare, along with them, Of course, after this bit of sanctimony they proceed to change them, but what the heck.

The real issue with DP/FLEX is people go all ga-ga and forget that these are merely positions, and unless you are dealing with the player playing DP replacing the player playing FLEX (or vice versa) NONE of the rules concerning batting order, substitutions, or re-entry have changed.

Remember that (which if you can't there must be a lot of the other rules you can't remember, either, like my friend and the IFR) and you have 90% of the DP/FLEX rule locked.

[Edited by Dakota on Jan 28th, 2005 at 12:01 PM]

DP and FLEX "are merely positions?"

Oh - if only it were that simple!

Although true - I think that completely oversimplifies things and does not lend much to comprehensive understanding.

Here's how you know the DP/FLEX rule is extremely complicated: Try to explain it to somebody who has no knowledge of it. How quickly can they "get it?" How long does it take you to explain it? How many questions do they ask?

Or - do they just look at you like a dog that heard a strange sound?

I am an assistant coach for my daughter's 16U team. We play in a lot of ASA and AFA tournaments. For years, I have tried to explain the DP/DEFO (now DP/FLEX) rule to the head coach. In his mind, it's nothing but a Designated Hitter rule. To a large extent, that thinking will work. Unfortunately, there is much more to it. Whenever I suggest to him some kind of substitution option that involves a more advanced aspect of the DP/FLEX rule (highlighting it's incredible flexibility), he always looks at me and says, "Can we do that?"

For instance, there may come a time in the game where it will be helpful for the DP to actually play in the field. I've finally convinced the head coach that the DP <b>can</b> play the field at any time. So he does! But, every once in a while, he has the DP playing for the FLEX. Sometimes I don't notice that he has done that. He doesn't tell the umpires.

I have to inform him that he CAN'T do that without notifying the umpire. This is a substitution. Fortunately, our opponents almost never notice this - especially when the DP takes over at a low profile position, like the outfield.

Whenever I explain this to him, he says, "I thought you said that I could put the DP in the field at any time without substituting."

Yes - <i>EXCEPT</i> for the FLEX!

Then he rolls his eyes, and resigns himself to the fact that the rule is simply too complicated. The really sad part is this ... we haven't even begun to scratch the surface of the OTHER aspects of the rule.

I've given up.

* * *

From the <u>Dirty Little Secret Department</u>:

One thing I've discovered about umpires over the years is that we have a tendency to subconsciously embrace highly complex rules. We fall in love with them. Deep down in places we won't openly admit to - we <b>like</b> these complicated rules. Complicated rules empower us. As long as such rules exist, it guarantees that WE will be smarter than everybody else. We'll be the experts! We'll know the rules better than the coaches, players, and fans.

This is why umpires just can't wait to point a finger in the sky and bellow out, "Infield fly, batter's out!" We eat that sh*t up! We <b>love</b> making those rare calls that nobody knows because, it shows how SMART we are. Most people cannot intelligently articulate the Infield Fly Rule ... so we like that rule, too!

Again, I'm not suggesting that these rules shouldn't exist. Certainly, we must have an Infield Fly Rule. I'm simply observing that <b>some</b> of these rules <b>are</b> a bit complex.

And, ultimately, the question is this: Which rules are NECESSARILY complex (like the Infield Fly Rule) and which ones are ARTIFICIALLY complex?

I suggest that organizations should root out those rules that are ARTIFICIALLY complex. Perhaps the DP/FLEX rule is one of those as evidenced by the fact that so few, for so long, have had difficulty fully grasping it.

Remember our discussion about what is legal or illegal (in ASA) regarding a batter-runner's ability to break for 2nd base after overrunning 1st?

<font color=blue>WestMichBlue:
<i>1. If she turns Right she must return to 1B
2. If she turns Left and starts towards 2B, she must continue to 2B.
3. If she turns Left and starts towards 1B, she must continue to 1B.
4. If she turns left - and stops - then she has option to go to 2B, or return to 1B</i></font>

Seriously now, is <b>that</b> necessary? Is this a complexity born of NECESSITY or ARTIFICIALLY asserted by rulesmakers and interpreters?

... stepping down from soapbox.

David Emerling
Memphis, TN

[Edited by David Emerling on Jan 28th, 2005 at 02:00 PM]

Because you've given up probably says more about your head coach than the rule.

You ridicule the notion that they are only positions, and unless replacing EACH OTHER, not much else is different.

Riddle me this, bat man, can any player in the game play any position on defense any time the coach wishes?

Yup.

Is the DP a player in the game?

Yup.

Can the DP, therefore play any position on defense any time the coach wishes?

Yup.

The ONLY caveat is when the coach wants the DP to play for the FLEX. Which causes your head coach's eyes to roll. I can't help that.

Tom wrote: <i>DP and FLEX "are merely positions?"</i>

He also stated that this covers 90 % of the rule.

Totally agree, with both his last two posts.

Re: Re: Re: A helpful hint
 

Thanks, Glen! I went to that site and it is really impressive. But, after 1/2 hour, I could not find the video. Does anyone know where it is on that site?

I suspected my last post would get some dander up. It always does. So nothing is new under the sun.

My intent was to neither defend nor attack the DP/FLEX rule. Like I said, I don't have a problem with it. I'm simply recognizing that too many people <b>DO</b>. Again ... why?

If explaining to somebody that they are "merely positions" conquers 90% of the problem - then why does the confusion persist? Why isn't anybody taking the time to come to this understanding? Why can't they?

It's difficult for somebody who understands something well (like almost everybody in this forum) to relate to those who don't.

<HR>SIDENOTE: I'm an airline pilot. There was a famous airline accident in 1987 that occurred in southern California. A disgruntled ex-employee of PSA airlines (now defunct) boarded a flight and shot the supervisor who had fired him. He did this while the aircraft was airborne. Then this disgruntled ex-employee shot both the captain and co-pilot ... then shot himself. The cockpit voice recorder recorded the screams of the 44 passengers as the aircraft accelerated beyond its structural limits before ripping apart. Almost every airline pilot I know asked the following question: Why didn't <b>somebody</b> attempt to fly the aircraft? There was nothing wrong with the aircraft. We couldn't conceive how anybody could not come forward and, at least, attempt to fly the aircraft. And the reason we had trouble comprehending that is because WE'RE PROFESSIONAL AIRLINE PILOTS!<HR>

We're umpires. We make a point of understanding anything that is complicated. We'll find a way to come to this understand one way or the other. Consequently, we have a difficult time relating to, or understanding, why others can't come to the same level of understanding that we have.

Rules in sports are not supposed to be proprietary.

Understanding how the FLEX, who is occupying the #10 spot in the lineup, can bat in the spot occupied by the DP is *not* an option born out of the understanding that they are "merely positions." Can the second baseman (a mere position), who is batting 7th, bat for the 1st baseman (a mere position), when the 2nd baseman takes over as the 1st baseman? NO!!!! Yet the FLEX, who is 10th in the lineup (but doesn't bat), *can* occupy another spot in the lineup.

I think the way the FLEX is handled administratively, by mandating that she be placed in the 10th slot, contributes to much of the confusion. I think it would be clearer if the FLEX were placed (parenthetically) alongside the DP in the batting order.

Don't shoot the messenger, guys! I'm on your side!

I'm simply observing that the knowledge regarding this rule is slim and that it is wildly pervasive throughout the softball community. No matter what one may think of the rule, good or bad, of <b>that</b> there can be no dispute.

David Emerling
Memphis, TN

[Edited by David Emerling on Jan 28th, 2005 at 02:29 PM]

Re: Re: Re: Re: A helpful hint
 

[/B][/QUOTE]

Thanks, Glen! I went to that site and it is really impressive. But, after 1/2 hour, I could not find the video. Does anyone know where it is on that site?
[/B][/QUOTE]

MA Softball Ump,

I'm not Glen, but if you go to the downloads section, under ASA. Click on the Line Up Management System. It's not a video, but a Power Point presentation.

I live on the Northshore. You've probably called some of my daughters games. Are you calling games at Strike-One in Danvers?

Kevin

WOW !!!!! i am going to be a 1st year umpire this year and I am just thrilled to use one of those ball/strike indicators. And hoping I don't screw that up.

Hmmmm.... I think you illustrate my point.

Let's see... when the FLEX bats, she is taking the place of the DP, right?

Ga ga ga ga ... how can this beeeeee!!! http://www.clicksmilies.com/s0105/fr...smiley-010.gif

One of the caveats to the "just a position", right?

Your head coach rolls his eyes because there is this exception when DP plays defense for FLEX.

Your unnamed confused masses go ga ga when the FLEX bats for DP! How can this be? Oh, the confusion, the complexity, the chaos! http://www.clicksmilies.com/s0105/fr...smiley-014.gif

http://www.clicksmilies.com/s0105/ak...smiley-002.gif

BTW, apparently unlike some umpires who self-describe themselves as reveling in complexity, I am pointing out how the complex reputation attached to DP/FLEX is for the most part unwarranted.

Resist the tendency to roll the eyes and go ga ga and just remember the routine rules about lineups, substitutions, batting order, and defensive position swaps.

Then, pay attention when DP goes in for FLEX on defense and FLEX bats for DP. You'll have it knocked.

Chess Ref,

You're a new umpire.

Go through Emily's Power Point presentation and see if you can work through the following scenario.

http://www.cactusumpires.com/pdf/lineup-asa-hs.ppt

<HR><u>SITUATION</u>: A team starts with 10 players. <b>Donna</b> is the DP, batting 3rd, and <b>Felicity</b> is the FLEX, in the 10th spot. <b>Felicity</b> happens to be playing 2nd base.

As the game proceeds, <b>Felicity</b> is removed as <b>Susan</b> replaces her at 2nd base. That makes <b>Susan</b> the new FLEX. Pretty straight forward.

Eventually, <b>Susan</b> bats for <b>Donna</b>. The FLEX can bat for the DP. Still, straight forward.

When the 3rd spot in the lineup comes up again, the coach decides to re-enter <b>Felicity</b> to bat for <b>Susan</b>.

Question: Is this a legal re-entry for <b>Felicity</b>? If so, can <b>Felicity</b> ever resume her previous role as FLEX and return to the 10th spot?<HR>

Does it help you to know that DP and FLEX are "merely positions?"

Keep in mind, Emily's Power Point presentation says, <font color=blue>"Once a player is listed in a slot 1-10, that is the only slot she can ever be in. That player LIVES in that slot. It is where she enters & leaves the game. It is the only slot a sub for a player can enter the game."</font>

Does that aspect of Emily's explanation help you?

Is that really true -or- with regard to DP/FLEX, is that explanation extremely misleading?

Do you think if a coach sat in on that presentation that he might walk away with a serious misconception regarding the DP/FLEX rule?

David Emerling
Memphis, TN

First of all, most umpires who revel in complexity are *not* self-described. In fact, they might even be the *last* to recognize this tendency on their part.

Remember, you're preaching to the choir. For the most part, WE get it! You're right - it's not all that complicated ... <i>FOR US</i>. And that's because we have taken the extra effort to understand it. And that's because we are burdened with enforcing it - whether we like it or not. It's not an option for us.

It *is* an option for coaches, however. They are neither obligated to use the DP or FLEX, nor are they obligated to use the flexibility that this rule affords. They don't even have to fully understand it to use it.

Yet, as umpires, we *are* obligated to understand every nuance, combination, permutation, ramification, and interpretation of the DP/FLEX rule. So, it's no wonder that we tend to understand it better.

It's not surprising that an umpire understands almost every rule better than coach. An umpire probably understands rules regarding obstruction better than a coach. But, with regards to the DP/FLEX rule, the gap between OUR understanding and that of the COACHES' is tremendous. And it has been that way for a very long time.

And it's *not* just the head coach of my daughter's team. It's pervasive!

David Emerling
Memphis, TN

David,

You seem to love to place yourself above the fray and argue on behalf of the poor unwashed all the while claiming to be a part of the intelligentsia who have been blessed with special understanding.

I am the opposite.

It ain't that complicated. Lots of people have made it sound such with their eye-rolling ga ga reactions and their complicated explanations of the rule.

Nonetheless, it ain't that complicated.

Coaches may choose to learn or ignore the rule, much like they choose to learn or ignore or operate in ignorant belief about a lot of other rules. That doesn't make it a complicated rule that is beyond the intellect of your average coach.

I can't help how coaches apply their time or their brain-power.

However, I can actively refute those who continue to claim this rule is too complex for the average ball player who scores 800 on some section of the SAT or who is a MENSA member or who forgets to match his socks before he leaves home in the morning.

Here it is:

Remember what happens when the DP plays defense for FLEX.

Remember what happens when the FLEX bats.

Remember that all other substitution rules, batting order rules, re-entry rules continue to apply.

There ya go.

[Edited by Dakota on Jan 28th, 2005 at 04:23 PM]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: A helpful hint
 

Thanks, Glen! I went to that site and it is really impressive. But, after 1/2 hour, I could not find the video. Does anyone know where it is on that site?
[/B][/QUOTE]

MA Softball Ump,

I'm not Glen, but if you go to the downloads section, under ASA. Click on the Line Up Management System. It's not a video, but a Power Point presentation.

I live on the Northshore. You've probably called some of my daughters games. Are you calling games at Strike-One in Danvers?

Kevin [/B][/QUOTE]

Thanks Kevin!

I actually saw the power point presentation. I thought that there was a video too.

I have not done any Essex County area, yet (mostly North Middlesex County). What summer TB team does your DD play for, I may have seen her...

I say dump the rule.

Those complaining about the complexity it creates for coaches should be reminded that this rule is the result of the coaches' demand, not something an umpire dreamed up.

This rule placates the coach who has a hitter that cannot play defense and a player who cannot hit worth a lick. It is posed as an "increased participation" point, but everyone complains about it.

As far as my personal feelings, I think that this rule can easily be declared as detrimental to the foundation of the sport as it eliminates many possible standard bat and ball sport strategies. This, like the DH in baseball, causes a dummying down of the game and coaching strategies. You want additional participation, fine, use the EP and leave it at that.

Some younger board members may not remember some of the great baseball we saw prior to the '70s. What a shame, you missed some great ball games. Comparatively speaking, today's game is a joke which is why I will no longer pay to see a MLB game.

Rant off!

I know I shortened your post to be out of context, but I just wanted to say...

You have a lot more against MLB than just the DH rule! :D

Many of your reasons I agree with, but I do still enjoy the game (even the AL flavor). http://www.clicksmilies.com/s0105/ak...smiley-002.gif

Arguing to take the DP/FLEX rule out as being contrary to the integrity of the game is one thing. But, that arugment would also apply to any of the "Dx" or "Ex" rules.

Arguing to take it out because it is too complex is quite another.

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: A helpful hint
 

[/B][/QUOTE]

Thanks Kevin!

I actually saw the power point presentation. I thought that there was a video too.

I have not done any Essex County area, yet (mostly North Middlesex County). What summer TB team does your DD play for, I may have seen her... [/B][/QUOTE]

Send me an E-mail You can get it from my profile or click o the icon below. I get a little weird about posting some information on the internet.

Better safe than.............

Kevin

[Edited by KJ'sDAD on Jan 28th, 2005 at 05:18 PM]

Agree.

I know I shortened your post to be out of context, but I just wanted to say...

You have a lot more against MLB than just the DH rule! :D

[/B][/QUOTE]

Out of context! Damn, you just as well have quoted War and Peace for as much sense as it makes.

I will not pay to see MLB games because I have a problem with:

DH
Salaries
Attitudes
Expected adoration
Selfishness
Demand of money for autographs
Lack of "team"
Salaries
Prima Donnas who are paid millions and still use excuses for failure to perform that are not even accepted at the LL level.
Demand of money for autographs
Expected adoration
Salaries
Ticket prices
Selfishness
Parking prices
Expected adoration
Concession prices
Salaries
Expected adoration
Demand of money for autographs

BTW, isn't one of the boys of summer of Texas a good ol' boy from Delaware? He seems to be one of the nicer guys around, and yes, there are a few of them, but the bigheaded, "I love me" monsters give them a bad rep.

Any other questions about my love for the game?

Did I mention the exhorbitant salaries?

JMHO,

No, Mike just salaries.