iIlegal or not?

Had this question asked of me the other day, "Can the pitcher take the pitchers plate in NFHS with the ball in her glove and toss it from her glove to her hand legally?" I say I can't find a rule or a casebook play that that would make it illegal. Can anyone help me?

[WestMichBlue]

I agree with you - legal. Actually, it is a clever way to solve the problem of steping on the plate with the ball in the glove, then reaching into the glove to remove the ball, then bringing the hands together again - which is illegal.

So if she tossed the ball rather then removing the ball from the glove, I find that legal.

However, she has "started her pitching motion" so she better not stop.

WMB

[Elaine "Lady Blue"]

Good answer, WMB!

[Bandit]

If we all agree that "tossing" the ball from the glove to the hand is not qualify as "touching" how can we say that the pitching motion has "started" ? Does not the pitch "start" when the hands seperate?

[Dakota]

Originally posted by Bandit
Does not the pitch "start" when the hands seperate?

Not in NFHS. That is one indicator, but the other is any motion that is part of her windup (my wording is imprecise - I don't have the book with me today to actually quote.)

[Bagman62]

Here is the wording from Rule 6 art 2 sec a "The pitch starts when one hand is taken off the ball OR after the pitcher makes any motion that is part of the windup AFTER the hands have been broght together."

My understanding is the pitch does not begin until:
1. the hands are brought together
2. The hands are separated.

In situation described the hands have never been brought together so I count off time and apply the following if the ball has not been pitched.

Section 2 Infractions by the pitcher
Art 3 Once the ball has been returned to the pitcher, the pitcher has 20 seconds to release the next pitch

[Edited by Bagman62 on Sep 14th, 2004 at 08:04 PM]

[Tex]

My first thought was to agree, that there is nothing wrong with the tossing of the ball to the other hand.

Then I second guess myself. I could see the hands getting closer and closer together after each toss. At what point do you call “the hands have come together” the second time. I also thought about a dropped ball during the toss.

I believe the first toss I would let go. The second toss I would be warning the coach to stop this tossing, or an illegal pitch will be called. Too many problems could arise with this toss.

[SC Ump]

Originally posted by Tex
The second toss I would be warning the coach to stop this tossing, or an illegal pitch will be called. Too many problems could arise with this toss.

But what rule do you quote when the coach registers a protest stating that you are making up rules?

[Dakota]

Originally posted by Bagman62
My understanding is the pitch does not begin until:
1. the hands are brought together
2. The hands are separated.

Speaking NFHS, #2 is not true. I agree the hands have to come together before the pitch can start, but consider this...

1. Pitcher's hands are in motion
2. They come together, still in motion
3. They separate for the backswing

In ASA, the official start of the pitch is #3. In NFHS, it is #2.