Softball Stats

[Palmer]

Two Stat Verifications Please/If someone could help me with a few batting stat dynamics. I would be appreciative.

1) A Batter intentionaly bunts in attempt to sacrifice and advance a base runner. The 3rd baseman and 1st baseman both charge the bunt, pick it up cleanly and turn to throw to 1st base. However, there is no one there to cover the throw. The 1st baseman is close to home plate and the 2nd baseman did not cover 1st base. No specific physical error is made, except behind mentally asleep. Is this a fielders choice, base on errors, a hit or a sacrifice.

2) Does a fielders choice have to have an out associated with it. Can an error be made in attempt to get out a preceding baserunner and still be called a fielders choice.


Respectfully

Palmer

[UmpireErnie]

OK scoring isn't the umpire's specialty, but I have read the rule so I'll toss out my educateded guesses and see if the Scoring Gods strike me down!

1. Dosn't matter that the intent was a sac bunt; it is a fair ball, the defense made no feilding error they just had no play and the batter was safe at first. Single.

2. A Fielder's Choice has to have the opportunity of an out associated with it. An error on a preceding runner that; had the out been made, would have resulted in the BR being scored a Fielder's Choice will still be a Fielder's Choice.

[chuck chopper]

1) base hit
2) Need an out for an FC.

[mcrowder]

Actually, Chuck, you don't need an out for an FC. You need an attempt at a different base, where the scorer can safely assume a play on the batter would have been an out.

For instance - runner on 3rd, no outs, infield back. Routine grounder to the pitcher. Pitcher fires home, but the runner is alert and beats the throw back to third. There is no out, but this is a fielder's choice (and yes - an at bat with no hit, so a detriment to the batter's batting average), assuming the scorer assumes the batter would have been out had the play gone to 1B.

On the bunt play - if there were no runners on base, you'd have scored this a single without thought - there's no difference. Base hit.

[chuck chopper]

Wouldn't the scorer rule batter reached 1st on an error not on an FC.

[mcrowder]

Error on who? There's no error in that play.

[chuck chopper]

I believe fielders choice is defined as; an act of a fielder upon receiving a batted ball, chooses to put out one runner, and allows other runner/s to advance to another base. In the example you metioned the pitcher allowed the batter to advance to 1st but did not get an out. So the scoring would either be batter reached on a base hit, or reached on the pitchers error. I do not believe this to be a base hit.

[mcrowder]

That's not correct.

A fielder's choice is a ball which would be an out if the fielder tried to get the batter out, but in which the fielder chose to make a different play (regardless of whether such other play turned into an out).

[UmpireErnie]

This is why I am glad I don't have to rule on scoring!

So mcrowder, do you agree with me that the 2nd play of the original post would have been scored as an error for the preceding runner's adavance and an FC for the batter-runner reaching first? Assuming batter-runner could have been putout if the feilder had not chose to go for the preceding runner?

[mcrowder]

Yes, you can have a FC and an E on the same play. Like the sitch I described, but instead of runner retreating to third, pitcher throws the ball past the catcher and she's safe at home. Batter reaches on FC, Runner scores on E1.