DP/FLEX

db · #1 (**permalink**) Mon Apr 19, 2004, 09:02am

Can the Flex at the start of the game only play in the field for the DP without any other substitution?
Can the FLEX play in the field for another player?

Dakota · #2 (**permalink**) Mon Apr 19, 2004, 09:11am

Quote:

Originally posted by db
Can the Flex at the start of the game only play in the field for the DP without any other substitution?
Can the FLEX play in the field for another player?

Please clarify your question. I don't understand what you are asking.

It is easier to think of it in these terms... The DP bats for the FLEX.

The DP may play on defense at any time for any player, so if you try to think of who the FLEX is "playing defense for" you can get very confused.

Perhaps you can ask again giving specific examples of player moves.

db · #3 (**permalink**) Mon Apr 19, 2004, 09:26am

The coach started the DP in the eighth spot and the Flex in 10 and then said he wanted to play the Flex in the field for the 9 spot. Can he do this with out anyone leaving the game?

mick · #4 (**permalink**) Mon Apr 19, 2004, 09:39am

Quote:

Originally posted by db
The coach started the DP in the eighth spot and the Flex in 10 and then said he wanted to play the Flex in the field for the 9 spot. Can he do this with out anyone leaving the game?

Defensive position is irrelevant.
As long as FLEX does not bat, then no one has left the game.
FLEX may not bat for B9.
If FLEX bats, FLEX may only bat at B8 for the replaced DP.
DP and FLEX may play defense at the same time as FLEX does not bat.
mick

Dakota · #5 (**permalink**) Mon Apr 19, 2004, 09:55am

Quote:

Originally posted by db
The coach started the DP in the eighth spot and the Flex in 10 and then said he wanted to play the Flex in the field for the 9 spot. Can he do this with out anyone leaving the game?

What did he do with the player at the #9 batting order spot?

db · #6 (**permalink**) Mon Apr 19, 2004, 10:07am

HE BATTED THE PERSON IN THE 9TH SPOT HE STARTED THE GAME WITH.

Dakota · #7 (**permalink**) Mon Apr 19, 2004, 10:16am

Quote:

Originally posted by db
HE BATTED THE PERSON IN THE 9TH SPOT HE STARTED THE GAME WITH.

No, I meant on defense.

Example (putting names, etc., to your situation as I understand it)...

Sally is FLEX and playing F6 (SS);
Joan is DP, batting B8.
Kirsten is batting B9 and playing F7 (LF).

Coach moves Sally to LF. Legal. Where did Kirsten go (on defense)?

db · #8 (**permalink**) Mon Apr 19, 2004, 10:24am

The coach wanted Joan to play SS and Sally to play F7 for Kirsten to start the game?

Steve M · #9 (**permalink**) Mon Apr 19, 2004, 10:37am

DB,
Yes, that move is OK. Your change is a defensive position change and does not affect the batting order.

Dakota · #10 (**permalink**) Mon Apr 19, 2004, 10:38am

Quote:

Originally posted by db
The coach wanted Joan to play SS and Sally to play F7 for Kirsten to start the game?

This is legal.

What you have is a defensive position swap of Sally to F7 for Kirsten, and then Joan (the DP) playing defense at SS for Kirsten. Kirsten still bats B9; Joan still bats B8; Sally still does not bat. No one has left the game.

DaveASA/FED · #11 (**permalink**) Mon Apr 19, 2004, 11:01am

The way I remember it is this #1 Flex plays defense. If Flex does not play defense there has been a substitution. DP bats for Flex on offense. Now the power of the DP/Flex option is that the DP may also play offense for any player other than the Flex without any substitution taking place. That is the power, if you need to have a talk with Kirsten about her play today you bring her in and let the DP play defense! I think one thing that is confusing (at least to me) about your post is you are talking about the Flex playing a different position for Kirsten. The only way we can have that (without a substitution) is if the DP comes in and plays defense for somewhere while the Flex plays left and Kirsten has a discussion on the bench! To further state it as long as Kirsten still bats when it is her turn she has not left the game.

One way to look at it is the offense and defense are seperate when you use the DP/Flex. Looking only at offense as long as the top 9 positions do not change, meaning girls 1-9 on the line up card bat the entire game there has not been a substitution. Now on defense the Flex player must play defense, if not then a substitution has occurred. Now the added power is that the DP (who is in the game, remember we started with 10 on the line up) can play defense for anyone but the Flex with no substitution. Basically think of it this way, you have 10 players to choose from to field 9 on defense (without subbing) the Flex and any other 8 of the top 9 in the line up. And those other 8 can change at any time with no penalty (as long as they are in the top 9 in the line up). Not sure if that cleared anything up or not but I tried!

kellerumps · #12 (**permalink**) Mon Apr 19, 2004, 01:46pm

DP/Flex (Twins) are in the lineup Flex can only bat/run for DP. When that happens the DP has left the line-up so you have substitution and are eligible to re-enter per re-entry guidelines.

Flex can play defense for DP or ANY OTHER PLAYER. As long as the other player bats, you have not changed your lineup so no substitutions.

DP can play defense for any other player. As long as the other player bats, you have not changed your lineup so no substitutions. IF DP playes defense for Flex, then you have substitution for the flex and the flex is eligible to re-enter per re-entry guidelines.

If the Flex does not play defense, then they have left the game and are eligible to re-enter per re-entry guidelines.

When the twins are active, just make sure the DP bats and the flex plays defense. If the flex bats, it had better be for the DP. If not you've got a problem.

Is this clear as mud now? There is a great chart in the NCAA rulebook that explains this rule very well.(Same ruling as ASA I believe). There is also a good power point presentation regarding how to keep a lineup card straight when you have alot of these types of changes.

Alot of umpires seem to have problems with this rule. Just make sure the lineup doesn't change and everything else just falls into place.