Obstruction ???
 

ASA C State

R1 on 2nd base B2 hits shot to outfield rounds first and is obstructed going to 2nd base. R1 has rounded 3rd base and is a little more than half way to home when B2 is tagged out at 2nd. Base umpire kills the play having to called dead ball 3 times to finally stop play as the defense was trying to get R1 out at the plate.

What should be done with R1 as she was between 3rd and home when the play was killed? By the way she beat the throw home easily.

Award the base you judge she would have reached.

Why was the play killed at all? Seems if he is working a state level game, should know this sitch a little better

Rule?

It's a Delayed Dead Ball for Obstruction once B2 was put you have to kill the play and award accordingly.

I'm trying to visualize this in my head. And I don't work ASA so maybe that matters here but I don't think so.

I know it's delayed and I know you award once runner is out but I'm not stopping play for all other action. I'll let it play out and award as needed. It's the only way I've ever seen it done

What codes do you work???

Usssa and nfhs. Usssa 8.13 says to award the obstructed runner and any runners affected. It also says ball becomes dead when time is taken to make awards. Says nothing about killing it immediately when obs runner is put out.
I didn't look up nfhs,usssa book is free online and fed isn't

Both USSSA and NFHS are delayed dead ball and if the Obstructed runner is put out you kill the ball. Here are the rules and or penalty

USSSA Rule 8 Sec 13.
When a runner is obstructed while advancing or returning to a base, by a fielder who neither has the ball nor is attempting an initial play on a batted ball, it shall be a delayed dead-ball.
EFFECT: If the obstructed runner is put out prior to reaching the base that would have been reached had there not been obstruction, a dead ball is declared and the Umpire shall award the obstructed runner, and each other runner affected by the obstruction, the bases they would have reached, in the Umpire’s judgment, had there been no obstruction.

NFHS Rule 8-4-3

PENALTY: (Art. 3b) When any obstruction occurs (including a rundown), the umpire will signal a delayed dead ball. The ball will remain live.
a. If the obstructed runner is put out prior to reaching the base that would have been reached had there not been obstruction, a dead ball is called and the obstructed runner and each other runner affected by the obstruction will be awarded the base or bases which would have been reached, in the umpire's judgment, had there not been obstruction. An obstructed runner may not be called out between the two bases where she was obstructed.

Yep. Understood. I just don't think having to yell dead ball 3x, as noted in the OP, is necessary. Throw out the left arm, state obstruction and award as necessary. I've never been one to overcook calling dead ball. Not saying you are by any means, just always seemed easier to me to award once play was basically dead anyway.

If you do not kill the play you open a can of worms if another play is made and the ball was not killed.

I can see that. Guess I have just never had it happen.

They say Missouri is the "show me" State. ;) ;) :p :p :D :D

OK, I was lazy with my post above ( #4 ) . :rolleyes:

When we make this call, I like to make eye contact with my partner(s). PU may not have seen the OBS signal or heard you. Once they see my hands in the air, they will generally figure that something is up. If the players want to keep playing, no big deal. We killed it. We have all the time in the world to make the call.

I always, no almost always, repeat dead ball calls loudly; partly to be sure I'm heard with everyone yelling and partly to avoid injuries by stopping play. Even if I can stop looking at players long enough to look at my partner; I want him/her to know a soon as possible. There is no harm in announcing it more than once.
Except things like HBP, etc.

Partners really do not need to know that you have OBS. For that matter, it is probably better that s/he doesn't know. All umpires need to just umpire the game in front of them as it unfolds without consideration to a partner's DDB signal.

Then you're doing it wrong (in either rule set).

The delayed dead becomes actual dead if the obstructed runner is put out before reaching the award base. You then award ALL runners the base they would have achieved absent the obstruction. You do NOT let it play out.

Yep. Got it. Had it with the previous posts. No need to reiterate what has already been stated

I really do think I have never had it happen. Almost every obs call I can remember/recall ends up in the player obtaining next base or being safe at the previous base.

Are you trying to shut down this forum??? :D:D

That's good for an early morning laugh!

Often a person will come to the forum after not having been on for awhile and start reading posts. Sometimes, they will only read the first or first few posts on a thread and then enter their comments.

Sometimes, this results in a repeat of what has already been said. It happens...it's not an attack on anyone....let it go.

I thought it was all meant in fun, especially my Missouri comment.

My :D:D was an indication!

I resemble that remark, :p!

MTD, Sr.

Okay the reason I posted this is because as I came of the field an assistant UIC states he is very upset at how we handled a play during this game. The AUIC stated once we killed the ball those not affected by the Obstruction should be put back to the last base they legally held (R1).

When we got back to the Umpire area the head UIC (newer UIC I think second year) and another AUIC backed the 1st AUIC's ruling on the play.

When I brought out the Rule book and Read both the Rule and Rule Supplement I was still told we handled it wrong. This really upset me as I take pride in my knowledge and Mechanics.

After the tournament I talked to my local UIC who backed my ruling and how I handled this. I emailed the State UIC who also agreed with the way we handled this.

My challenging the UIC staff cost me games on Sunday. I have never not worked on a Sunday and almost always have a final.

Glad to see that most of those that gave input here had the correct awards.:)

Your AUICs are erroneously applying the Interference Rule regarding placement of runners in their interpretation of this play... and punishing the offense for the defense's infraction...

I've never worked a tournament where "performance" affected working additional days/Sunday. I'm glad of that. We just always have the number of guys we need to work the Tourn and they work both days.

The difference here is that the tournament in question was an ASA Championship Play event...State C tournament.

In my neighborhood, we do the same thing. Fri/Sat schedules are set, then as the number of games are reduced due to teams being eliminated, the umpires that have performed the best on Fri/Sat are assigned on Sunday. Just like a National tournament.

Though it isn't always possible to wait to schedule that far, when it is possible performance should be the sole consideration for assignment.

Man, to have that luxury [emoji12] around here, sometimes we have to scramble for bodies just to cover the games. It sucks. Guy I worked with yesterday is a renowned terrible umpire. But, he said yes when others said no. Plus, I really only do weekend Tourn, I don't have a lot of chances for long ones and nationals/worlds never appeal to me. I don't want to burn 40 hours of vacation time to work one. Especially in July heat!