Two dead ball personal fouls

[alabamabluezebra]

A22 runs the ball to B's 33 yard line where he is tackled. After the ball becomes dead, A11 commits a PF against B44 who also commits a PF in retaliation. Under 10-2-4, do you mark off both penalties even though in this case the ball comes back to B's 33?

[BktBallRef]

Yes. It may seem like a waist of time but eventually, you'll have a situation where it's important to walk the penalties off. If you're of the mindset that it doesn't matter, you'll get into a habit and not walk it off when it does make a difference.

[alabamabluezebra]

I had the umpire walk off both penalties but my LJ was surprised and mildly disagreed. The only reason I brought up the question is 10.2.4 Situation A under ruling states "This is not a double foul. However, since the the yardage penalties offset,..."

[JRutledge]

Originally posted by alabamabluezebra
I had the umpire walk off both penalties but my LJ was surprised and mildly disagreed. The only reason I brought up the question is 10.2.4 Situation A under ruling states "This is not a double foul. However, since the the yardage penalties offset,..."

I personally would say not to walk it off if you know you will end up in the same place. But if you have a half the distance situation, then that is another story all together.

Peace

[Warrenkicker]

You should mark off all penalties unless they were dead-ball or unsportmanlike fouls where the order of fouls were not certain. In the play in question there was no change in the position of the ball on the field and the down. However if the defense fouled first and then the offense the ball would have ended up at the 33 but it would have been 1-10 if the line-to-gain was not past B18 (10-4-2 Situation C).

[BktBallRef]

Even if the ball does end up in the same place, a foul against the defense first could result in a first down.

Mark it, signal the foul, signal 1st down, mark the 2nd foul, signal, set the chains, and blow the ready.

[JugglingReferee]

Originally posted by alabamabluezebra
A22 runs the ball to B's 33 yard line where he is tackled. After the ball becomes dead, A11 commits a PF against B44 who also commits a PF in retaliation. Under 10-2-4, do you mark off both penalties even though in this case the ball comes back to B's 33?

I can't imagine that you would see an umpire in Canada walking off these off-setting penalties. A-1D/10 @ B-33.

Mike

[Edited by JugglingReferee on Sep 8th, 2003 at 05:37 PM]

[Ed Hickland]

Originally posted by JRutledge

I personally would say not to walk it off if you know you will end up in the same place. But if you have a half the distance situation, then that is another story all together.

Peace

Under NCAA Rules the penalties offset and the walk-offs are not necessary.

NFHS rules and mechanics require all dead-ball penalties to be enforced. Seems silly and confusing to those who don't understand. But the philosophy is that no dead-ball foul goes unpunished.