Chop Blocks

FridayKnights · #1 (**permalink**) Fri May 23, 2003, 06:06pm

Like to get some information on chop (cut) blocks by the o-line.

At a HSFB game last year I asked a ref if chop blocks are legal. My definition of a chop block is when one offensive lineman is engaged with a defensive player and another offensive player engages the same defensive player with a low block. This is illegal in the NFL as it has a high injury risk factor.

What the ref told me is the block is legal as long as the second defensive player waits one second after the first player engages the defender. If the second player hits the defender in less then one second its illegal. The ref said as long as the offensive player waits the one second it does not matter if you hit the defender high or low it's still a legal block.

Most people argued that hitting a defender high and low (high/low block) in the neutral area (tackle box) is always illegal.

I know the chop block is illegal in the NFL does anyone know the rule in HSFB?

mikesears · #2 (**permalink**) Fri May 23, 2003, 08:14pm

Quote:

Originally posted by FridayKnights
Like to get some information on chop (cut) blocks by the o-line.

At a HSFB game last year I asked a ref if chop blocks are legal. My definition of a chop block is when one offensive lineman is engaged with a defensive player and another offensive player engages the same defensive player with a low block. This is illegal in the NFL as it has a high injury risk factor.

What the ref told me is the block is legal as long as the second defensive player waits one second after the first player engages the defender. If the second player hits the defender in less then one second its illegal. The ref said as long as the offensive player waits the one second it does not matter if you hit the defender high or low it's still a legal block.

Most people argued that hitting a defender high and low (high/low block) in the neutral area (tackle box) is always illegal.

I know the chop block is illegal in the NFL does anyone know the rule in HSFB?

From the rulebook.

Rule 2-3-9: Chop block is a delayed block at the knees or below against an opponent who is in contact with a teammate of the blocker in the free-blocking zone.

Note the rule does say "Delayed block at the knees." Also note that engaging low then high is legal. It is high then low that is illegal.

ABoselli · #3 (**permalink**) Fri May 23, 2003, 11:12pm

So the official you spoke with got it backwards - if he waits, then it IS a foul. If it is a simultaneous high/low, there is no foul. The thinking, as I understand it, is a DL is far more vulnerable once he is already engaged with an OL, planting and using his leverage to advance. A hit at the knees at that point can cause more damage than one that happens on the initial "firing out" stage of the play.

TXMike · #4 (**permalink**) Mon May 26, 2003, 07:59pm

F.K.: Please tell me this was not in Texas?

Sleeper · #5 (**permalink**) Tue May 27, 2003, 08:31am

Now Mike, you know that all officials in Texas are perfect and would NEVER give this type of advice to a player.

Bob M. · #6 (**permalink**) Tue May 27, 2003, 09:48am

I assumed that the original question was for a FEDERATION state. Mike Sears' answer definitely was for FEDERATION. However, the FED restriction on chop blocks does require that the delayed low contact takes place against an opponent who is "...still in contact..." with another blocker. So, while the "one second" quote by the official is not supported specifically by Federation rules, he is in principle correct that if the contact is broken, the defender becomes fair game. I don't like it, but that's the way the Fed rule reads.

As you know (better than I), you could write a treatise on the NCAA chop block rule -- high/low, low/high, low/low, delayed/simultaneous, behind/in/beyond the neutral zone. Yikes!! And the NCAA restrictions extend to a defender who has just disengaged from another blocker. This particular restriction is preferable to the Federation rule.

TXMike · #7 (**permalink**) Tue May 27, 2003, 10:35am

Thye differences are mond boggling and it never ceases to amze me how you guys can keep them straight. I would be a basket case trying to work both codes.

The way I read the original question was that the 1st blocker was still in contact. If that is the case, there is no issue about, disengaging, still confronting, etc. It is flat ILLEGAL. (Apparently in ALL the codes)

I am still hoping it was NOT in Texas.

[Edited by TXMike on May 27th, 2003 at 10:38 AM]

BktBallRef · #8 (**permalink**) Wed May 28, 2003, 11:38am

Quote:

Originally posted by Bob M.
So, while the "one second" quote by the official is not supported specifically by Federation rules, he is in principle correct that if the contact is broken, the defender becomes fair game....

...if all other requirements for blocking below the waist are met.

Bob M. · #9 (**permalink**) Wed May 28, 2003, 02:40pm

Thanks for pointing that out. You are correct that all other criteria allowing a BBW must be met!

mike rumer · #10 (**permalink**) Sat Jun 07, 2003, 06:22pm

I am a umpire.LOVE the middle.As for chop blocking the umpire must know, on dive plays all blocks WILL be low.
On pass plays is when chop blocks occurs the most.The offensive lineman will back up blocking high.If another offensive player makes contact low,[below the waist], you have chop blocking.In all the games I have ever done,it`s usually [not always] the team that getting thump badly doing the chop blocking...Sometimes another offensive lineman may get knocked around and ends up hitting the defensive lineman low,NO foul..A GOOD umpire will know the deference.

Schmidt MJ · #11 (**permalink**) Mon Jun 09, 2003, 08:06am

[QUOTE]Originally posted by mike rumer
If another offensive player makes contact low,[below the waist], you have chop blocking.

Maybe I'm nitpicking here,but chop blocking is a delayed block at or below the knees. Not at or below the waist. True it can be a gray area especially if you don't see the whole play, but we need to make sure we're not misleading ourselves on this discussion board.

Bob M. · #12 (**permalink**) Mon Jun 09, 2003, 10:08am

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Schmidt MJ

Quote:

Maybe I'm nitpicking here,but chop blocking is a delayed block at or below the knees. Not at or below the waist.

And in NCAA rules, the low block is defined as occurring at or below the thighs. Just one of the 236,721 rules differences. (Used to be 236,722, but now Fed has PSK!!)

BktBallRef · #13 (**permalink**) Mon Jun 09, 2003, 10:03pm

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Schmidt MJ

Quote:

Originally posted by mike rumer
If another offensive player makes contact low,[below the waist], you have chop blocking.

Maybe I'm nitpicking here,but chop blocking is a delayed block at or below the knees. Not at or below the waist. True it can be a gray area especially if you don't see the whole play, but we need to make sure we're not misleading ourselves on this discussion board.

No, you're not nitpicking. There's a huge difference in hitting below the waist and hitting at or below the knees. Good correction.