Ki-o-Rahi (Maori football)

[Forksref]

No steroid use in NZ? LOL Speaking of "your head in the sand?"

[KWH]

Here's an idea...
Perhaps if we all were to stop responding to this KIWI he might just go away!

[National Party]

billynomates you need to appreciate that thereare Americans dying to save your ungrateful ***.i'm stating how things are inNZ not beingracist or radiclelike you are.all NZ people now have guaranted access to the seashore.I've also found this fella kingi gilberts hole too, he resides at Whakarongo.com and I'm thinking him and taha maori might be closer than mates? lotsof high falutin talk about intilectuals knowledge, looks like a free radicle site, some sort of staging area for truoble makers?
Moving on,my golf handicap is down to 9,I'm stoked and I can't waitfor Superbowl!

[Edited by National Party on Dec 8th, 2004 at 01:17 PM]

[Taha Maori]

These days, especially in matters to do with $$$$$ SORRY is the hardest word to get out of people who con others. This thread has been full of American Football officials/refs/enthusiasts who know how rife drug and steroid use is in their chosen sport, yet not once did any of these people openly condone such practices.

Truthful campaign ads should be aired on American TV that state, "encourage your child to play our great game, AMERICAN FOOTBALL, they will need to become drug and steroid junkies to be able to aspire to become WORLD CHAMPIONS in our (closed to the rest of the world) WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP."

Several contributors have even thrown in red herrings, like "we are basketball world champs" (not even) and "we have the best golfer in the world" (sorry fellas thats a Polynesian),and we had some war mongerers claiming that Americans are united in their search in Iraq for the huge munition dumps of WEOPONS OF MASS DESTRUCTION - stating boldly that Americans cannot be duped!....to diverge from the threads focus on society/sport and their mutual affects.

I feel that particularly virulent comments have been directed at myself from ABoselli and JMN (and other backers)over issues of drug and steroid use in American Football and about how society reflects the sports that it cherishes.Quite simply if American sport stops the drug and steroid trade it will go away, at the moment athletes from all over the world innocently strive to get American Uni scholarships thinking that doing so will enhance their sports ability - they are right, but only once they are coercedo into a drug program.

Now that the damaging US sports drug issues have been unveiled, US sports policies are beginning to copy the NZ "clean" and open sports values that we have in Ki-o-Rahi, we can once again ask ABoselli, JMN and others to apologise to the American public for their deceit. This thread is silent testimony to their American Football thoughts and practices and steadfast denial of steroid and drug use by players.

Afore mentioned citizens, America awaits your honourable reply.

[Rich]

Originally posted by Taha Maori
These days, especially in matters to do with $$$$$ SORRY is the hardest word to get out of people who con others. This thread has been full of American Football officials/refs/enthusiasts who know how rife drug and steroid use is in their chosen sport, yet not once did any of these people openly condone such practices.

Truthful campaign ads should be aired on American TV that state, "encourage your child to play our great game, AMERICAN FOOTBALL, they will need to become drug and steroid junkies to be able to aspire to become WORLD CHAMPIONS in our (closed to the rest of the world) WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP."

Several contributors have even thrown in red herrings, like "we are basketball world champs" (not even) and "we have the best golfer in the world" (sorry fellas thats a Polynesian),and we had some war mongerers claiming that Americans are united in their search in Iraq for the huge munition dumps of WEOPONS OF MASS DESTRUCTION - stating boldly that Americans cannot be duped!....to diverge from the threads focus on society/sport and their mutual affects.

I feel that particularly virulent comments have been directed at myself from ABoselli and JMN (and other backers)over issues of drug and steroid use in American Football and about how society reflects the sports that it cherishes.Quite simply if American sport stops the drug and steroid trade it will go away, at the moment athletes from all over the world innocently strive to get American Uni scholarships thinking that doing so will enhance their sports ability - they are right, but only once they are coercedo into a drug program.

Now that the damaging US sports drug issues have been unveiled, US sports policies are beginning to copy the NZ "clean" and open sports values that we have in Ki-o-Rahi, we can once again ask ABoselli, JMN and others to apologise to the American public for their deceit. This thread is silent testimony to their American Football thoughts and practices and steadfast denial of steroid and drug use by players.

Afore mentioned citizens, America awaits your honourable reply.

Every time I read one of these posts it reminds me of the spam I get telling me I've won 2,000,000 dollars from some guy I've never met if only I send him 10% to process the fund transfer.

[ABoselli]

I'd forgotten my "virulent" comments.

What did I say - I don't feel like reading every post for 7 pages.

BTW, why the sudden steroid rant? The NFL has a pretty strict policy on steroids, hence the suspensions that are handed out regularly. Baseball is the sport without a steroid policy, to which I say, umm, so what?

Anything else you hate the United States for or is that about it? Being near Festivus and all, it is time for the "airing of grievances".

[jimbulger1]

Originally posted by ABoselli
I'd forgotten my "virulent" comments.



Anything else you hate the United States for or is that about it? Being near Festivus and all, it is time for the "airing of grievances".

what a great non seinfeld use of "festivus"

Kudos to a boselli

[Bob Lyle]

How did this thread get so far without a fatal intervention of our nanny?

[jimbulger1]

Originally posted by Bob Lyle
How did this thread get so far without a fatal intervention of our nanny?

the nanny is still rotfltao

[Taha Maori]

As an example: American football has many refs, more the merrier and this is an expectation by the players. Hence we have an American Football rule book, thousands of pages long, supported by 5,6 ... referees.

Result, American Football players have devised strategies, an unwritten code or culture that could probably equal the 'official rules' book, to beat the rules and the refs.

compare this to America as a nation, x no. of people playing "the game" as related to world affairs. The expectation by American people, as for the players of American Football, is that they will be reffed (by other nations and organisations ie. UN) and that they are 'entitled' to try to circumnavigate "the rules".

Result....because the "nation refs" are 'weaker' than the players (American Govt.) the players (USA) play how they want, ...

On world scale their philosophy becomes..."we will lie and cheat, and torture and maim who we want, when we want, for whatever reason we want to...to win!" Absolutely no self reflection or self reffing, because they (US) are incapable of doing so. As in sport, such attitudes are fostered with international relationships.

simply an example about how American expectations on the sportsfield mimic the attitude of American society in world relationships...sports reflect the society they inhabit and VV...

[Edited by Taha Maori on Dec 13th, 2004 at 03:30 PM]

[kdf5]

Originally posted by Taha Maori
As an example: American football has many refs, more the merrier and this is an expectation by the players. Hence we have an American Football rule book, thousands of pages long, supported by 5,6 ... referees.

Result, American Football players have devised strategies, an unwritten code or culture that could probably equal the 'official rules' book, to beat the rules and the refs.

compare this to America as a nation, x no. of people playing "the game" as related to world affairs. The expectation by American people, as for the players of American Football, is that they will be reffed (by other nations and organisations ie. UN) and that they are 'entitled' to try to circumnavigate "the rules".

Result....because the "nation refs" are 'weaker' than the players (American Govt.) the players (USA) play how they want, ...

On world scale their philosophy becomes..."we will lie and cheat, and torture and maim who we want, when we want, for whatever reason we want to...to win!" Absolutely no self reflection or self reffing, because they (US) are incapable of doing so. As in sport, such attitudes are fostered with international relationships.

simply an example about how American expectations on the sportsfield mimic the attitude of American society in world relationships...sports reflect the society they inhabit and VV...

[Edited by Taha Maori on Dec 13th, 2004 at 03:30 PM]

I think you better lay off the Steinlager.

[ABoselli]

Umm, OK.



Was that you on the beach in "Whale Rider"?

[Bob Lyle]

Originally posted by Taha Maori
As an example: American football has many refs, more the merrier and this is an expectation by the players. Hence we have an American Football rule book, thousands of pages long, supported by 5,6 ... referees.

Result, American Football players have devised strategies, an unwritten code or culture that could probably equal the 'official rules' book, to beat the rules and the refs.

compare this to America as a nation, x no. of people playing "the game" as related to world affairs. The expectation by American people, as for the players of American Football, is that they will be reffed (by other nations and organisations ie. UN) and that they are 'entitled' to try to circumnavigate "the rules".

Result....because the "nation refs" are 'weaker' than the players (American Govt.) the players (USA) play how they want, ...

On world scale their philosophy becomes..."we will lie and cheat, and torture and maim who we want, when we want, for whatever reason we want to...to win!" Absolutely no self reflection or self reffing, because they (US) are incapable of doing so. As in sport, such attitudes are fostered with international relationships.

simply an example about how American expectations on the sportsfield mimic the attitude of American society in world relationships...sports reflect the society they inhabit and VV...

I would like take this opportunity to apologize to the man from Wheaton. On several occasions, I've called him the dumbest poster on this forum. After reading the Maori posts, I must acknowledge that I was wrong.

[Taha Maori]

Well Bob can see who the movie, The Waterboy, was based on.
You obviously aren't a reader, far be it for a New Zealander to try and make the linkages for you (and your brethren) but reality is reality Bob, I'm sorry to have to inform you, but thats life - Sport IS a reflection of the larger society. Let me put it another way Bob & co, American Football IS a reflection of US society.

Try to catchup on a little reading from your own writers on the subject if that will make it easier, common sense is very hard for some people to grasp, (Orwell - "To see what is infront of one's nose needs a constant struggle" or even the basic "live not by lies" - Solzhenitsyn). Your esteemed writers/social commentators such as Colby Cosh, Steve Sailer and Nick Shultz have written prolifically on the sociological, psychological and biological aspects of sports in society and their inter-relationships.

[Taha Maori]

Hot off our presses boys, sorry about the news article length Bob (easy, just take it one word at a time) -

Its a bit like a Keystone Cops drama or CIA bungle with leaked reports and "gagging" notices issued to key "players" involved in negotiations to compensate Maori for the use of their Intellectual Knowledge.

Helen Clark (NZ Prime Minister) has brought MP John Tamahere back into the fold, even though he owes the IRD several hundred thousand dollars - enough to put a 'regular' citizen behind bars for a very long time, because without him the legislation would not retain its so called "agenda" and momentum.

Other key players are Maori Intellectual Knowledge Law consultant Kingi Gilbert and NZ Rugby Union chief executive Chris Moller. In our national paper, NZ Herald (23/12/04), Moller stated that "several million dollars" would be "lost" from the NZ union coffers because of the adverse international exchange rates. The Governments estimation of compensation to pay aggrieved Maori miraculously just happen to be the same ballpark figure! You work that one out.

Why the "hush, hush" and aggravation in Helen Clarks Government? Because this cloak & dagger legislating has been 18 months in the making and theres still over 12 months to go. The unofficial 'official' date being bandied about for the 'shock' release to the unsuspecting NZ public is Feb 6, 2006. Now that date sounds familiar?

It sounds like a 'take it or leave it' deal is being brokered and Maori will not receive a just amount for their cultural heritage being so blatantly ripped off.

The claim is based on indigenous Maori ball sports being appropriated by the British colonists from first contact on to the late 1800’s. All because the development of rugby was not acknowledged by the British as having originated in NZ. I bet the French are now happy their colonists didn’t do the same!

Affected recipients of monetary compensation will, unusually, not be ‘all’ Maori, with payments not going to the Iwi authorities, but directly to only the sub-tribes (how will that allocation be worked out??) who still practice playing their traditional ball games. And this really shows how blatantly secretive the NZ Government is, they are using private investigators and their own SIS (Secret Intelligence Service) to locate the sub-tribal areas where ballgames such as Ki-o-Rahi, Poi Toa, Tapu Ae and Kiora (and others) are being played.

I feel this scheme is an injustice in itself – to me compensation should go to the descendants of the original ball playing tribes, not to the areas where our games may have suddenly just been started so that those people can claim some of the millions on offer. Real gravy train stuff. And get this, there is no lodgement process!, the NZ Government is sole arbitrator of which sub-tribes will get compensation payments! And what about Tamahere, Clark, Gilbert & Moller what will their brokerage fees be?

I would expect our media to deal more thoroughly with this issue, but will they?
And why the sudden need to acknowledge that Maori were ripped off? No it wasn’t based on ideals of injustice but the fact that scores of rugby pitches around NZ since the 1980s have been “tagged” (by who else, but “Maori Radicals”) in large letters, burnt in with weed killer, spelling out the historically traditional games associated in that area –sportspeople were/are annoyed that Pakeha ideals for funding criteria (such as from the now defunct Hillary Commission for Sport & Recreation) could not be applied to traditional ballgame organisations. Without funding, the traditional games could not hope to compete for consumers, and that is precisely what has happened.

The NZ Rugby Union was spending tens of thousands of dollars repairing its rugby grounds and having to cover-up “tagging” incidents, sometimes minutes before big televised games were to start! The NZ Rugby Union want to quickly, well relatively quickly going by the pace set by The Waitangi Tribunal, settle.

The great dialogue coming out of this clandestine operation is that once the NZ Rugby Union has paid off its minimal amount, the ‘cat can be released out of the bag’ and intellectual property law trouble shooter, Kingi Gilbert will lodge claims against ALL worldwide rugby unions, and against all sports organisations that play a sport derived from rugby- these include rugby sevens, touch rugby, rugby league and American Football – should be some battle with billion dollar claims!



So thats it fellas, looks like you've got 2 xmas' left before you have to frontup to the International Court (thats if you caught the last paragraph)
So salutations from NZ for 2005!
"Knowledge is good" Animal House