is it possible

[benbret]

Team b is winning by 5 35-30. Team A scores on a pass and we have a live ball 15 yd foul and a dead ball 15 yard foul on A. B will take both penalties on the kickoff. During a missed try team A is charged with a 15 yard live ball foul. Team B will take this penalty on the kickoff. The score is now 36-35 Team A winning with 15 seconds left in the game. Can Team B kickoff from the 30, hope to get an on side kick inside the 20 and try a field goal to win the game.

[BroKen62]

Originally Posted by benbret

Team b is winning by 5 35-30. Team A scores on a pass and we have a live ball 15 yd foul and a dead ball 15 yard foul on A. B will take both penalties on the kickoff. During a missed try team A is charged with a 15 yard live ball foul. Team B will take this penalty on the kickoff. The score is now 36-35 Team A winning with 15 seconds left in the game. Can Team B kickoff from the 30, hope to get an on side kick inside the 20 and try a field goal to win the game.

Quick answer without looking is no, the missed try is not a scoring play b/c no points were scored.

[Robert Goodman]

Originally Posted by benbret

Team b is winning by 5 35-30. Team A scores on a pass and we have a live ball 15 yd foul and a dead ball 15 yard foul on A. B will take both penalties on the kickoff. During a missed try team A is charged with a 15 yard live ball foul. Team B will take this penalty on the kickoff. The score is now 36-35 Team A winning with 15 seconds left in the game. Can Team B kickoff from the 30, hope to get an on side kick inside the 20 and try a field goal to win the game.

Why didn't B take the penalty for the original live ball foul and negate the TD?

And if they did enforce just 2 penalties, wouldn't those be enough to move their spot for a chosen kickoff to the non-offending team's 30 in Fed?

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by benbret

Team A scores on a pass and we have a live ball 15 yd foul and a dead ball 15 yard foul on A.

Acceptance of the live ball foul would negate the TD.

During a missed try team A is charged with a 15 yard live ball foul.

This penalty is declined. If it's accepted, Team A gets to retry the PAT.

Also, Team B is not going to kick.

[tomes1978]

Make the live ball fouls dead ball fouls after the score and it's possible.

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by tomes1978

Make the live ball fouls dead ball fouls after the score and it's possible.

Actually, it's not.

The OP wrote, "Can Team B kickoff from the 30, hope to get an on side kick inside the 20 and try a field goal to win the game."

Team B isn't going to kick off. Team A is. And Team A is NOT going to kick an onside kick when they're winning a game with 15 seconds remaining.

The entire premise of the original post makes no sense whatsover.

[Reffing Rev.]

Didn't I read somewhere that the opponents of the scoring team determine which team kicksoff following a score, so couldn't team B decide to kickoff after a Team A Score, and go down in history as the craziest bunch of yahoos to play the game since the invention of the forward pass?

[tomes1978]

Originally Posted by BktBallRef

Actually, it's not.

The OP wrote, "Can Team B kickoff from the 30, hope to get an on side kick inside the 20 and try a field goal to win the game."

Team B isn't going to kick off. Team A is. And Team A is NOT going to kick an onside kick when they're winning a game with 15 seconds remaining.

The entire premise of the original post makes no sense whatsover.

Rule 8-3-9: reads .... after a try, the opponent of the scoring team shall designate which team will kick off.

So B could elect to kick off, take the penalties try an onside kick and recover it, and kick the field goal to win the game.

[BktBallRef]

Got news for you my friend. Coaches don't know that rule.

[JugglingReferee]

Originally Posted by benbret

Team b is winning by 5 35-30. Team A scores on a pass and we have a live ball 15 yd foul and a dead ball 15 yard foul on A. B will take both penalties on the kickoff. During a missed try team A is charged with a 15 yard live ball foul. Team B will take this penalty on the kickoff. The score is now 36-35 Team A winning with 15 seconds left in the game. Can Team B kickoff from the 30, hope to get an on side kick inside the 20 and try a field goal to win the game.

CANADIAN RULING:

It depends on the nature of the live ball 15-yard penalty.

But yes, it is possible for B to kickoff to A, with the three (3) 15-yard fouls enforced, leaving B kicking from the A-20.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by benbret

Team b is winning by 5 35-30. Team A scores on a pass and we have a live ball 15 yd foul and a dead ball 15 yard foul on A. B will take both penalties on the kickoff. During a missed try team A is charged with a 15 yard live ball foul. Team B will take this penalty on the kickoff. The score is now 36-35 Team A winning with 15 seconds left in the game. Can Team B kickoff from the 30, hope to get an on side kick inside the 20 and try a field goal to win the game.

Wow ... this one is a mess for 5 reasons off the top of my head. Want to start over?

[jemiller]

It would take some luck and some explaining on the front end about B deciding who is going to kick-off, but yes I think that it is possible. Wacky idea...but possible. Jim

[The Roamin' Umpire]

Originally Posted by benbret

Team b is winning by 5 35-30. Team A scores on a pass and we have a live ball 15 yd foul and a dead ball 15 yard foul on A. B will take both penalties on the kickoff. During a missed try team A is charged with a 15 yard live ball foul. Team B will take this penalty on the kickoff. The score is now 36-35 Team A winning with 15 seconds left in the game. Can Team B kickoff from the 30, hope to get an on side kick inside the 20 and try a field goal to win the game.

I'm using NFHS rules here.

Note the bold section. Team B is going to enforce the live-ball foul and take the points off the board so that they're still WINNING 35-30.

But, let's assume that by "live ball 15 yd foul" you meant something penalized as a dead ball foul (i.e. nonplayer or unsportsmanlike). Then the first two penalties mentioned may be taken on the kickoff.

Now go to the underlined section. By rule (NF 8-3-6), this penalty must be declined - there is no option to carry it over to the kickoff.

But again, let's assume you meant something treated like a DBF. Then that penalty is also assessed on the kickoff.

If A kicks off, they're kicking from their own 6.25-yd line. If B elects to kick off, they're kicking from the opponents' 15. With 15 seconds left, I think B is smarter to make A kick and try to return it - the risk of a touchback is too high.

Now, if there's 5 seconds left, then maybe the onside makes sense - the clock will only start when/if the other team touches it. But, in this increasingly improbably scenario, A now has a very smart play to make - they should step offsides. This moves the kickoff to the 10. Now there's no way to recover the onside kick - if it goes 10 yards, then it's in the EZ for a touchback.

So, the short answer is: yes, it COULD happen. But it would be stupid.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by The Roamin' Umpire

But, in this increasingly improbably scenario, A now has a very smart play to make - they should step offsides. This moves the kickoff to the 10. Now there's no way to recover the onside kick - if it goes 10 yards, then it's in the EZ for a touchback.

Well, if we're changing the OP so that it means what he meant it to mean, and you get this far... then when A "smartly" steps off-side, B would just as smartly decline the penalty.

[Robert Goodman]

After a spot is moved by penalty, can the team scored on rescind their choice of kicking or receving?