Penalty in the end zone - Page 2

Mike Simonds · #16 (**permalink**) Fri Jul 12, 2002, 10:13pm

Thanks Jimmie. I really appreciate sharing insights with all you fellow officials out here. I'm in my 9th year and I'm still learning.

I agree with you on this ruling. Its the final result of the play that dictates the basic spot for penalty enforcement. If B does not fumble then the basic spot is the 20 yard line because B was tackled in the end zone and the final result of the play is a touchback. If B fumbles the ball out of bounds at the 3 yard line then the basic spot is the goal line because the end of B's run was in his end zone.

BBR might be right but after I read the new rule and case books with the new comments under rule 10 I'm still willing to bet my silver dollar collection on my answer.

Take care and I'm looking forward to many more questions this season!

BktBallRef · #17 (**permalink**) Sat Jul 13, 2002, 12:26am

I'm just curious. How can you read this statement, "Any loose ball that occurs after a run ends in the end zone is ignored in determining the basic spot for penalty enforcement," and still not believe that the NF wants the penalty assessed from the 20? Why else would they put the statement in the case book?

I don't know. It seems confusing at best. I guess I'll let my R and U sort it out.

mikesears · #18 (**permalink**) Sat Jul 13, 2002, 09:07am

I am more willing to stake my reputation as an official on a CASEBOOK play than on a play from quarterly newsletter.

From the front of the casebook:

"This Football Case Book has been designated as the OFFICIAL SUPPLEMENT to the rules book by the National Federation of State High School Associations (NFHS)."

Also from the case book:

"The interpretations and rulings for all situations have been approved by the rules committee and are official."

My bet is that the case book is where we should get our answer to the question.

mikesears · #19 (**permalink**) Sat Jul 13, 2002, 09:12am

From the NFHS website (Rule Interpretations section):

SITUATION 18: B1 intercepts a forward pass in his end zone and attempts to advance. While in the end zone, A1 tackles him by the facemask and B1 fumbles. The ball bounces forward into the field of play and rolls out of bounds at B's 2-yard line. RULING: If the penalty for A1's facemask foul is declined, a new series is awarded to Team B at the out-of-bounds spot. Since the final result of the play is NOT a touchback, the enforcement spot is B's goal line if the penalty is accepted. First and 10 for Team B on its 15-yard line.

Which one is official? The casebook or the website?

mikesears · #20 (**permalink**) Mon Jul 15, 2002, 01:04pm

Quote:

Originally posted by mikesears
From the NFHS website (Rule Interpretations section):

SITUATION 18: B1 intercepts a forward pass in his end zone and attempts to advance. While in the end zone, A1 tackles him by the facemask and B1 fumbles. The ball bounces forward into the field of play and rolls out of bounds at B's 2-yard line. RULING: If the penalty for A1's facemask foul is declined, a new series is awarded to Team B at the out-of-bounds spot. Since the final result of the play is NOT a touchback, the enforcement spot is B's goal line if the penalty is accepted. First and 10 for Team B on its 15-yard line.

Which one is official? The casebook or the website?

I posted this earlier then went back and read the NFHS.ORG webpage again. This is a rule interpretation for 2001. It appears they have reversed gears in the 2002 casebook and they want this called a touchback for penalty enforcment purposes.

BktBallRef · #21 (**permalink**) Mon Jul 15, 2002, 09:30pm

I went to the NFHS site looking for this year's interps and found last year's. It'll be interesting to see if they address this specific play again.

mikesears · #22 (**permalink**) Tue Jul 16, 2002, 09:44am

Quote:

Originally posted by BktBallRef
I went to the NFHS site looking for this year's interps and found last year's. It'll be interesting to see if they address this specific play again.

If it contradicts the casebook, which one is the official ruling?

BktBallRef · #23 (**permalink**) Tue Jul 16, 2002, 10:07am

Whatever my R decides to go with.

Theisey · #24 (**permalink**) Tue Jul 16, 2002, 01:08pm

Quote:

Originally posted by mikesears

Quote:

Originally posted by mikesears
From the NFHS website (Rule Interpretations section):

SITUATION 18: B1 intercepts a forward pass in his end zone and attempts to advance. While in the end zone, A1 tackles him by the facemask and B1 fumbles. The ball bounces forward into the field of play and rolls out of bounds at B's 2-yard line. RULING: If the penalty for A1's facemask foul is declined, a new series is awarded to Team B at the out-of-bounds spot. Since the final result of the play is NOT a touchback, the enforcement spot is B's goal line if the penalty is accepted. First and 10 for Team B on its 15-yard line.

Which one is official? The casebook or the website?

I posted this earlier then went back and read the NFHS.ORG webpage again. This is a rule interpretation for 2001. It appears they have reversed gears in the 2002 casebook and they want this called a touchback for penalty enforcment purposes.

### Where in the case book do you see the NFHS reversing gears and indicate this penalty is enforced from the 20 rather than from the goal line as I think it should be???

BktBallRef · #25 (**permalink**) Tue Jul 16, 2002, 09:27pm

Tom, we're basing it on the Comment after case play 10.5.2B. The Comment states: Any loose ball that occurs after a run ends in the end zone is ignored in determining the basic spot for penalty enforcement. I first saw it in a post by SRH on McGriff.

mikesears · #26 (**permalink**) Wed Jul 17, 2002, 07:18am

Quote:

Originally posted by Theisey

Quote:

Originally posted by mikesears

Quote:

Originally posted by mikesears
From the NFHS website (Rule Interpretations section):

SITUATION 18: B1 intercepts a forward pass in his end zone and attempts to advance. While in the end zone, A1 tackles him by the facemask and B1 fumbles. The ball bounces forward into the field of play and rolls out of bounds at B's 2-yard line. RULING: If the penalty for A1's facemask foul is declined, a new series is awarded to Team B at the out-of-bounds spot. Since the final result of the play is NOT a touchback, the enforcement spot is B's goal line if the penalty is accepted. First and 10 for Team B on its 15-yard line.

Which one is official? The casebook or the website?

I posted this earlier then went back and read the NFHS.ORG webpage again. This is a rule interpretation for 2001. It appears they have reversed gears in the 2002 casebook and they want this called a touchback for penalty enforcment purposes.

### Where in the case book do you see the NFHS reversing gears and indicate this penalty is enforced from the 20 rather than from the goal line as I think it should be???

Either I am starting to imagine things or I just can't find the case book play in the casebook. Spending too much time on McGriffs board can do that to a person

BBRef stated that the comment appears in the case book but I can't find the play I thought was in there.