Change of Possession, untimed down??

[Bob M.]

Originally Posted by JugglingReferee

CANADIAN RULING:

...What is the definition, in Fed please, of a forward handoff?

REPLY: Fed Definition (NF 2-19-2): Forward handing occurs when the runner releases the ball when the entire ball is beyond the yard line where the runner is positioned.

[Bob M.]

REPLY: Eventually DrMoore, you got to the right ruling. The period is over. And you subsequently did point out a flaw in the IFP penalty. An IFP by B after a change of possession does not specify loss of down and therfore would require an untimed down. But this is thoroughly inconsistent with the intent of the 3.3 rule calling for the period to end (without an untimed down) if the penalty includes a loss of down provision. The actual play that caused that rule to be accepted a few years back was one where on the final play in regulation, A ran down near B's goal line and threw a forward pass to a teammate for a TD. B was obviously forced to accept the penalty which resulted in an untimed down in which A kicked a FG and won the game. That same situation could just as easily happen after a COP.

And by the way, while illegally handing the ball forward in NCAA also includes LOD if by Team A (but not by Team B after a COP), NCAA does not have the exception to the rule which eliminates an untimed down if the foul includes LOD.

[ajmc]

Allow me to share a definition I heard a long time ago, "Bureaucracy: When written rules come in direct conflict with common sense, and you choose to enforce the rule (or some unique or obscure interpretation of it), rather than reason the objective."

[Robert Goodman]

Originally Posted by Bob M.

REPLY: Fed Definition (NF 2-19-2): Forward handing occurs when the runner releases the ball when the entire ball is beyond the yard line where the runner is positioned.

But Fed doesn't define "where the runner is positioned" in relation to a particular part of the body, and if you're releasing a ball, some part of the runner's body must be touching it and hence at the same yard line.

They could clear that up if they wrote, "...entire ball is beyond all parts of the body of the player releasing it other than upper and lower extremities." Or, "...beyond the head, neck, and trunk of the player releasing it." I think that's what they really mean. Or they could adopt NCAA's definition and rely on an intuitive sense of where the players are in relation to each other.

Robert