Questionable play/call

Here is a play I had a few weeks back. It is bothering me and I want to see what you guys would have done or if I really blew the call.

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Team A has the ball 4th and 25 at their own 5. Less then 30 seconds before half-time. They do NOT a time-out. I had informed the coach that they did not have a time-out.

The QB drops back throws a bomb and and team A gets the ball to B's 10, first and goal. Mind you that I am way behind the play with the QB, etc. A reciever down field calls a time-out and the covering official (BJ) gives the team a time-out. By the time I get up there and find out what had happened both teams were already heading to the sidelines.

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I fired a flag off for Delay of game on A. Then with five seconds left on the clock I started the clock on the ready and A did not get another play off. Which I felt A would not have gotten another play if they did not call a time-out.

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In the rule book it doesn't clearly give such a foul and I understand my (BJ) made the mistake of awarding a time-out which shouldn't have been done. Under Rule 3-6-2 f "Any other conduct which unduly prolongs the game."

What I am looking for is what do you thing I should have done?

I an ex-USMC and this is my 5th year with a WH....I am always looking to learn, thanks!

[Edited by tpaul on Nov 4th, 2004 at 11:03 AM]

[mikesears]

We also make a habit of letting both TEAMS know that team A is out of timeouts. We also communicate this as a crew to one another to preven this form happening. But if it does happen, I would simply start the clock per rule (RFP after a 1st down), and not worry about complaints. You let the head coach know he was out of timeouts. He shouldn't have huddled them at the sideline.



[Edited by mikesears on Nov 4th, 2004 at 11:32 AM]

Mike, Thanks.

I have been a lot tougher with my crew when a team doesn't have anytimes left. I wanted to do like you said and crank the clock but the deefense was thinking a time-out was called and went to the sideline. I didn't want A to some how jump in there and get a play off or something stupid like that. I thought A gained an unfair advamtage and penalized them...

[Bob M.]

REPLY: And Tom, there is no support for assessing a delay of game. In my opinion, the best thing you could have done was have your wings get both teams back onto the field immediately. Let both teams know that you're going to start the clock on the RFP. Once the box gets set, blow the RFP.

[MJT]

When a team is out of TO's, not only do the coaches need to be notified, but all official need to be reminded. When we get in these "end of the game" situations, and one team is in the hurry up, I try to often remind my crew that "white" is out of TO's. We need to "all" know that, and not grant it when requested. If we accidently do, we will tell them ASAP that they have none, and when the the opposing team is ready, I would wind the clock.
In BB, a TO asked for when you are out is a "T" and I think it should be at least a "delay" in FB, but just IMO.

BOb,
I agree... Live and learn...

[ABoselli]

Wow - tough one.

You've still got an official's TO as we wait for the box man to come down (usually not the most fleet of foot guy ut there) and you can, in that time, get the teams back on the field. A can always ground the ball, even if it's just the center and QB standing there. Sure, they'd take a penalty, but they'd get a play.

It points out that we always have to be cognizant of the little things - confirming the # of TO's for each team after one is called. If the TO was granted by one of the officials, I'd be hard pressed to penalalize A (time-wise) in terms of blwing it ready fr play real quick, especially if B is also off the field. I'm not sure that's what happened, but I'd give a little leeway myself.

MJT,

I agree with you it should be a penalty but it currently is NOT....

ABoselli,

I agree with what you're saying looking back but at the time the head coach knew he had no times outs. I am pissed about my BJ awarding one when they didn't have it. And I am still a little pissed at myself for handling it wrong. I hope this may help somebody in the future, including myself!

Thanks guys

[chiefgil]

NFHS: After a delay of game penalty, the clock will start on the snap.

[Rich]

Originally posted by chiefgil
NFHS: After a delay of game penalty, the clock will start on the snap.

True, but this isn't a delay of game penalty -- it was completely mishandled. It is a crew error, pure and simple. This isn't basketball, where we grant every timeout request and penalize excessive timeouts. This is football, where we are supposed to know how many each team has and respond, "You don't have any left."

[mcrowder]

I agree they should not have called DOG. One poster asks, though - since they did call DOG, why did they start the clock - and lists a perfectly good reason why they should not start the clock if DOG was in fact the call.

My answer to that... if the referee determines that a penalty by either side is used to improperly waste or conserve time, he can start or stop the clock on the ready or snap as appropriate.

An example of when one might use this rule to START the clock after a Delay of Game: Defense is behind, and offense can run out the clock by downing the ball, but for some reason it's 1st and 25 (or perhaps it's jut 3rd and 11). As soon as the ball is snapped, defense kicks the ball (intentionally or unintentionally ... I do know refs that will call intentional kicks of this sort USC - I'm not one of them). The call here is delay of game on the defense, but if you start the clock at the snap, the defense gains clock advantage from their penalty - I would start it on the ready in this case, as should most referees.

mcrowder,

That is why I started the clock. I felt the team called a time out. They delayed the game. I didn't want the clock to be stopped that is why they wanted the time-out.

Yes, I screwed up the call..thanks for your imput!