Deadball on Kickoff

[trainman52]

K kicks ball 6 yards and ball rolls to a stop. Niether K or R make any attempt to down the ball. At what point should it be called dead? If both teams are standing over it and R goes to touch the ball to down it and at the time of touching K grabs the ball and falls on it, whos ball is it. The ball was idle for at least 3-5 seconds before the touching.

Thanks,

[Theisey]

That's more than enought time. AS long as no player from either team is attempting to possess it, kill it.

(oops, hit enter key).
Team-R should have no business trying to "down" the kick. Their touching would allow team-K to then legally secure possession. If I saw this play as you described, I would have whistled it dead after about 3 seconds at most.

[Edited by Theisey on Sep 28th, 2004 at 01:17 PM]

[Patsfan2431]

If the play resulted from a scrimmage kick, once the ball is laying (dead) for more than 2 seconds, i kill it. In the case of R touching the ball and then K jumping on it. I would have R with a muff, and K having recovered the Muff (dont allow any advance of the ball by K). First and 10 for K.

If the play is resulting from a free kick (you said "Kickoff" in your subject), then the ball is live. I have never seen a free kick being blown dead on the field of play because of neither R nor K is trying to recover it. In the case that this does happen, i would blow it dead after my two second rule (of'course, when no player is trying to recover the ball). In the case R touches the ball (Muffed), the ball remains live and K can recover.

[Theisey]

if I may get a little techincal, even though it's a Free Kick down, while the ball is in the 10 yard zone between the free kick spot and team-Rs free kick line, it's status is no different than a scrimmage kick. Meaning, any team-K touch is a first touching spot. It's live alright, but only for team-R.
Over the years I've seen maybe a half dozen or so free kicks travel less than 10 yards and die untouched by anyone.
Kill it no one attempts to pick it up after a couple seconds.

[Patsfan2431]

Yes, that is correct. I neglected to mention the exception.

[schmitty1973]

I thought the ball was supposed to be blown dead when it quits moving. Or is that just on a punt?

[cowbyfan1]

Originally posted by schmitty1973
I thought the ball was supposed to be blown dead when it quits moving. Or is that just on a punt?

Nope any kick if no attempt to gain possession is being made. Just because it stops rolling does not mean R cannot still come and try to pick it up and advance it.
As it is laying there I would be looking around to see if someone is running at the ball to possibly try and grab it. If someone is I would keep it live ball for a couple more seconds. If no one is running at it, then 2 or 3 seconds is enough to rule it dead.

[PSU213]

First off, I dislike the phrase "live ball" when talking about a free kick that has gone 10 yards. When an untouched scrimmage kick goes downfield it is also a live ball, even though K cannot recover and advance (yes, I know they can never advance it). The same applies for a free kick that has not gone 10 yards.

Also, since coaches like to yell "it's a live ball," I would doubt K would just stand there and watch the ball.

In the case that it was just sitting there without anyone moving toward it, I would blow it dead once it is apparent no player is trying to possess it (maybe 1-2 seconds).