Following the Georgia incident the thought of having the Rule Book available on the field comes up again.

I am interested in knowing how many already have a Rule Book readily available.

Have you ever used a Rule Book to correct a misapplication.

Do you think having the Rule Book available is going to satisfy a stubborn coach.

we give a rulebook to the chain gang to hold for us, so far i have not used it.

I've never taken a rule book out to the field with me and I don't believe anyone on any of my crews has ever done so. If it can be done discreetly then I suppose it's OK, but no official actually working the game should have one on his/her person.

I keep all my books in my bag. That way I can check on a rule or mechanic at the half or after the game. NEVER would I have it on me during the game . As far as a stubborn coach goes, he's just going to have to trust me.

It seems to me that the rulebook on the field is just asking for trouble. If you look up one thing, then the coaches will likely ask after every call that you look it up. The rulebook is a little like having a bull's eye on you in my opinion.

Avoid one replay, have a thousand arguements with coaches. I guess it is a tough call.

Finally, it sounds like the officials screwed up in Georgia, and re-reading the rulebook likely would not have helped. If you misread the situation, correctly reading the rulebook would not help much.

what do you do if a coach wants a time out for a rule interpretation? he is entitled to one, even if he is wrong, he will be then charged a timeout. if you just dont have the answer, you cant run in the locker room to get the rule book. no one will even know if you have a rule book on the field, you are not broadcasting it. i have never had to use it, but i am sure there will be a time when we will need it. if the coach feels he is correct, he is not just going to take your word, he wants to see it in writing. i feel he would be entitled to see the rule for himself. i feel most people dont want a rule book on the field because they dont want to be proven wrong if a situation should arise. we have to be more accountable for our actions. it comes down to having confidence in ourself.

I agree with the above, that having the rulebook out there is trouble waiting to happen. If you just show him one rule (without definitions, etc.) things will be taken way out of context, and it really may look like you are wrong (imagine showing someone a kicking rule without them really knowing the definition of a kick). If you wanted to be thorough about it you may have to show him a few definitions and a couple of other rules. Not only would this halt the game for a while, but you still may not get anywhere in expanding the coach's understanding of the matter. I believe that the coach will just have to trust you at the time and at some point after the game your association can provide him with the relevant rules for any interpretations he questions.

Regarding the Georgia debacle. I corresponded with one of the reporters covering the story. It was a live ball personal foul but enforced as a dead ball personal. Was the difference between 3/18 or 1/10 deep in the offender's territory. The coach requested a timeout and argued the misapplication. A simple glance at the book and the story would have never been told.

And every walkoff will be questioned.

Bob

I can't speak to the NFHS book but the NCAA book can be so confusing that we zebras cannot even agree on what is being said. I imagine it would be even worse with a coach who has likely never looked at the book much anyway. Showing them the book is just going to confuse things.

Example: There is a rule that prohibits chop blocking. SO the coach may scream that someone is "chop blocking" and that is illegal as per "Rule 26-2-3-a". Problem is he knows nothing about Rule 2 which defines what a chop block is. So what he is calling a chop is not illegal anyway.

I'm with those that say having the rulebook out there isn't a good idea.

If a coach wants to request a conference and can locate the pertinent rule(s) himself and I, myself, am unsure, I may take a peek. But if I am completely sure of the rule, I won't look at a rulebook even if offered. And a vast majority of the time, I'm very confident in my application of a rule.

Furthermore, the rulebook isn't always enough to understand the rules. We sometimes need to see a casebook and/or handbook to completely support our calls. The rules are sometimes complicated and can't be addressed in short discussion with a coach.

I guess my bottom line is that I would only consider looking at a rulebook if the discussion will be short and when I am unsure of the application of a rule. But the coach will need to provide the book.











[Edited by mikesears on Dec 4th, 2003 at 07:38 AM]

I agree with the above. Having a rulebook on the field is a bad idea. Although sometimes it would be nice to prove to a coach what you did was right so he will stop complaining, it would just make more of a mess. It opens up a can of worms, he will keep asking you to see the rule.

If the coach wants to call a timeout and he has the rulebook then I will show him or listen to him, but if hes wrong he loses a timeout :)

I agree, it is a bad idea to have a rule book on the field. I call in Texas and agree with TXMike. The book is confusing enough for me and I spend 2-3 hours a week year-round studying it. A coach who is looking at it would have no clue about definitions and exceptions to the rules.

It is our responsibility to know the rules and spend the necessary time studying. My rule book is a big part of my offseason routine. The more time I spend reading it, the better off I am going to be on the field.

I have never taken one on the field. I have never seen anyone else with one on the field other than a coach (his was 3 or 4 years old at that point) I do have one in my bag for reference after a game.

[Edited by i011763 on Dec 4th, 2003 at 11:26 AM]

WARNING:
Just think of how many different interpertations we have ON THIS BOARD on the same topic/discussion. You would need more than the rule book wiht you. You would need the case book to cite the exact case and interpertaion of the ruling, illistrated(sp) rule book for clairfication, and the manual for whose coverage it is (and might be). The 2 minute drill done by teh NFL would be NOTHING compared to the s#!T we would have on our field. 15 minutes explaining and showing a coach why and all. It is a bad idea.

As a coach, I have asked officials in basketball to show me why. They have then sent me a ruling/case ruling to explain why. I have thanked them for the insight. Or if the coach REALLY TRULY cared, he could look it up HIMSELF, in his own book on the sideline. Then ask about it at 1/2 or end of the game. Each school is provided with 1 copy.

As for me, bad idea. Nothing good could come from having one on the field.

I sent this this to my own crew and thought I would share our collective thought process.
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We agree with the standpoint that we want to get the call right. But we better not be out there (at least collectively as a crew) if we can't enforce the rules properly. A game is no place to partake in a rules clinic. If a coach talks us into looking at the rule book in one instance, then Katy-bar-the-door if we think we're going to stop it from happening again and again.

Further, how do we convince a coach that we have the ruling right (as agreed upon by the entire crew) when we previously looked at a rule book in the game? That's a credibility issue. Also, why stop with looking at a rule book? Why not go over and look at the TV camera and the replay if someone challenges a fumble call? (I am being a bit facetious here, but where do you draw the line???) Finally, Officials have been vilified (and even occasionally vindicated) in lots of papers and on TV over the years. Most of us have never met a sports writer, radio or TV commentator, or coach who could hold our jock straps when it came to rules knowledge. If we (as a crew) have to explain a call to our supervisor or governing body (and everyone at some point has misapplied a rule), then that's the medicine that goes with the territory. Tom White faced it in the NFL. Last year's officials in the SF-GIA playoff game did too.


One of my crewmates quipped "Bringing a rulebook to an official is like bringing a Bible to Jesus. I just shouldn't happen".

No official would equate himself with Jesus (at least not publicly), but the official is the closest thing to the arbiter of final judgment that can exist in sports. Get the calls right - and be competent enough as a crew to do so on your own without intervention.

I agree with those who think the rule book does not belong on the field. However, most who visit this forum take the time to study the rules and probably have a good command of them.

But, I go back to Georgia. The facts are a player for Duluth punches a Dacula player during a play. Duluth got a first down on the play and the penalty was enforced from the end of the run giving Duluth a first down. The coach protested that the penalty should have been enforced form the spot of the foul (correct) giving Duluth a third down and 18 at the 12 not 1/10 at the 17.

Georgia authorities in their infinite wisdom upheld the protest and ordered the game replayed from the misapplication, 11:51 in the 4th quarter. Dacula still lost.

How can a situation like this be avoided, or can it?

The rules are tough to master but this was a simple interpretation. Live ball foul because it occurred during the play. I am sure the answer lies in knowing and understanding the rules. Yet, the impetus for seeking that level of knowledge may not be there at the high school level -- coaches who typically don't understand rules and mechanics determine who are the best officials. And, when one official in one game makes one mistake it reflects poorly on everyone because those naysayers who think officials don't know the rules have an example.

I agree with you that the GA situation was an easy mistake to correct. But using my own area as an example, I can't tell you the number of games I've seen where a personal foul was flagged and signaled as an unsportsmanlike conduct foul. Next year, I've asked my local association to talk about the differences between the two fouls and I hope they will let me contribute content. I thank this forum for pounding the difference into our collective heads.

I think sometimes the problem lies with inexperienced officials telling the white hat that they have an unsporting conduct foul when in fact they have a personal foul. The white hat fails to ask "what happened" and bing-ba-da-ding, we may have a mistake in application.

In the GA incident, I would love to have been privy to the conference to see what exactly was said and who was consulted.

Again, a couple of things.

Assuming that the Georgia crew was competent, but made a mistake.........

- they misread the situation in terms of a personal or an unsportsmanlike foul. Looking it up would have likely affirmed their decision because they would have looked up the rule that made it work for them (that's where anyone would look first)

- as for the coach showing me the rulebook..... I work 7 sports, and in 6 of them, as soon as the rulebook gets shown to me, the coach is ejected. This is just not tolerated anywhere else. Not that it is a bad thing, just interesting contrast.

Good one Mike Sears!!!
 

Like Moses told Aaron in the Book of Numbers: "Would all the Lord's people be prophets."

In other words: we succeed and we fail as a crew. Each crew member needs to be a rules expert. Each crew member needs to step-in and correct the ruling, penalty enforcement, etc. when he knows that an error has been made.

And most importantly, each crew member needs to be humble and admit when he makes a mistake.

In penalty administration, its most important to slow down, take our time, and get it right.

But also, the coaches need to know the rules in order to make a proper challenge at the place and time allowed by rule.

I don't like the Georgia ruling and the NFHS needs to update the rules so this does not happen again.

Oh, and by the way, I don't believe you should have a rule book on the field.

[Edited by Mike Simonds on Dec 4th, 2003 at 02:21 PM]