Anyone see this yet??

[JRutledge]

Kids get hurt and die in other sports almost as much as football, depending on the sport. This is a PR thing not a reality thing. Also most kids will never play beyond high school. I think people will just have their kids play later and not so early which is a good thing IMO. But it will never completely die when the carrot for scholarships and professional opportunity will be out there. Even if schools decide to drop the sport all together, there will be some club or non-scholastic option which many will take. Not everyone is going to play soccer or baseball because those sports cost a lot of money to participate at this time. At least at this point football is popular at all levels that I doubt players will completely stop participating. You might have fewer teams and more consolidation, but I do not see it going completely away even in 20 years.

Peace

[ajmc]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Kids get hurt and die in other sports almost as much as football, depending on the sport. This is a PR thing not a reality thing. Also most kids will never play beyond high school. I think people will just have their kids play later and not so early which is a good thing IMO. But it will never completely die when the carrot for scholarships and professional opportunity will be out there. Even if schools decide to drop the sport all together, there will be some club or non-scholastic option which many will take. Not everyone is going to play soccer or baseball because those sports cost a lot of money to participate at this time. At least at this point football is popular at all levels that I doubt players will completely stop participating. You might have fewer teams and more consolidation, but I do not see it going completely away even in 20 years. Peace

Think of the opportunities for all those excess football helmets. They could be used by our children while eating dinner, to protect against the possibility of falling off a dining room chair and striking their heads on the floor.

Then again, we could do away with tables and chairs, and simply eat off the floor, eliminating all risk of head injuries from falling. Unfortunately, that of course raises the risk level of other objects in the house possibly dislodging and becoming flying objects threatening those children sitting on the floor.

Wow, seeking absolute protection from everything can get very complicated.

[Rich Ives]

Originally Posted by ajmc

Think of the opportunities for all those excess football helmets. They could be used by our children while eating dinner, to protect against the possibility of falling off a dining room chair and striking their heads on the floor.

Then again, we could do away with tables and chairs, and simply eat off the floor, eliminating all risk of head injuries from falling. Unfortunately, that of course raises the risk level of other objects in the house possibly dislodging and becoming flying objects threatening those children sitting on the floor.

Wow, seeking absolute protection from everything can get very complicated.

Except falling off the chair is accidental and banging heads in football (or the ball in soccer) is deliberate and much more frequent.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Rich Ives

Except falling off the chair is accidental and banging heads in football (or the ball in soccer) is deliberate and much more frequent.

True, but there are a lot of sports that have potential harm. I love it when people say, "7 kids have died playing football this year" but when you examine that number, you find out there are other conditions that might have killed them other than actual football activity. I have heard of kids dying in baseball or basketball.

Peace.

[scrounge]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

True, but there are a lot of sports that have potential harm. I love it when people say, "7 kids have died playing football this year" but when you examine that number, you find out there are other conditions that might have killed them other than actual football activity. I have heard of kids dying in baseball or basketball.

Peace.

From what I read, 4 of the 7 (actually I think it's 8) this year were from underlying causes - could have happened in any game. Or even no game at all. But 3 or 4 were from actions directly attributable to the game (1 a ruptured spleen during a tackle - ok, kind of a freak accident, but still - and the others from head impacts).

Again, I don't think that fear of the extremely unlikely acute tragedy will kill the sport. But as we learn more about the long-term effects of everyday, subconcussive hits - the kind that are simply integral to the game - we'll see the sport wither to a fraction of its current size at the youth levels.

[Robert Goodman]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Kids get hurt and die in other sports almost as much as football, depending on the sport. This is a PR thing not a reality thing. Also most kids will never play beyond high school.

Not that many will even play in high school, even among the ones who played before HS.

I think people will just have their kids play later and not so early which is a good thing IMO.

But isn't it even safer playing before HS than playing in HS?

Even if schools decide to drop the sport all together, there will be some club or non-scholastic option which many will take. Not everyone is going to play soccer or baseball because those sports cost a lot of money to participate at this time.

Baseball & soccer are more expensive than football?! How's that? Football's got to cost more for equipment, insurance, officials, and practice.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Robert Goodman

Not that many will even play in high school, even among the ones who played before HS.

But isn't it even safer playing before HS than playing in HS?

Not if you are playing with people that are not teaching the game properly and technique. A lot of youth coaches are not teaching the same things they teach at the high school level and certainly do not emphasize safety the same way.

Baseball & soccer are more expensive than football?! How's that? Football's got to cost more for equipment, insurance, officials, and practice.[/QUOTE]

About all a kid buys for football is the shoes and some basic stuff to wear outside your uniform. A baseball kid has to buy a glove, a bat or have them provided and other things just to be able to play. Football most of the equipment is provided and not owned by the players. Also you are playing a lot fewer games and not playing weeks on end just to play close to 100 games. There is a reason that inner city kids are not playing baseball very much as they have to take on a financial commitment just to play. Right now most of the equipment for football is provided. Now if that changes that might change things, but a kid playing soccer has a bigger out of pocket expense to play. It is the same reason that only a certain class of person is playing golf and not the average kid. Also football makes more money for the school than baseball, golf or soccer when hardly anyone pays a lot of money to support those sports.

Peace

[Robert Goodman]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

About all a kid buys for football is the shoes and some basic stuff to wear outside your uniform. A baseball kid has to buy a glove, a bat or have them provided and other things just to be able to play. Football most of the equipment is provided and not owned by the players.

What's the difference who's paying for it, it's still more expensive equipment.

Also you are playing a lot fewer games and not playing weeks on end just to play close to 100 games. There is a reason that inner city kids are not playing baseball very much as they have to take on a financial commitment just to play.

You're referring to a very select segment of kids as playing 100 games (a year, I suppose). How does it look for the avg. child player? If you count total field time, practice + games, I bet it's more for football than for baseball for the avg. child playing adult-organized ball.

[jchamp]

Regarding equipment expense:
Financial burdens can be placed on different people, depending on performance level, regional culture and the type of league. The fact that private individuals frequently bear the cost for soccer, baseball, tennis, golf, etc., while it's public institutions or wealthy private schools that bear the cost for football, should shed light on the relative expense of football.

Regarding propensity to injury:
By the end of week 2 of the NFL season, enough players had had to be taken out of games with injuries to field the starting lineups for the entire CFL, and still have a few left over. Most of the injuries are related to collisions that occurs during play. Players in the NFL average 3.3 seasons. By comparison, most MLB injuries are related to chronic or excessive strain, and the average career length is 5.6 seasons.

Other sports typically considered "non-contact" such as baseball have their moments when it comes to injuries, but the difference is that it is shocking when they happen. When the two Cardinals outfielders collided near the end of last season, it was newsworthy partly because baseball players rarely have major concussions like that. The NFL and NCAA have only recently instituted programs to prevent football players from returning to the game after receiving concussions, while MLB is just recently detecting concussions in their players. That MLB plays 10 times as many games as NFL teams do, and their concussion rate is much lower, should tell a lot about the likelihood of injury in their games.

Finally, regarding ownership:
It shouldn't be embarrasing that football is more expensive and the players are more prone to injury. It's just an attribute of the game. If you ignore it, you prevent yourself from adjusting to the reality and responding as necessary. Enjoy the games you love, but respect the costs. Once you understand and appreciate the costs, you can be in a position to take the necessary actions to keep the game alive. Otherwise, you'll find yourself with no game, bitter about that fact, and living in a country with hundreds of enormous memorials scattered around the country, honoring a time when we paid people large sums of money (or marginally valuable educations) in exchange for entertainment.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Robert Goodman

What's the difference who's paying for it, it's still more expensive equipment.

You're referring to a very select segment of kids as playing 100 games (a year, I suppose). How does it look for the avg. child player? If you count total field time, practice + games, I bet it's more for football than for baseball for the avg. child playing adult-organized ball.

My point was not what is actually more expensive overall, my point was that schools have been funding the helmets and pads for years. I never payed to have most of the items that were necessary to play football. And that equipment is reused year after year. A baseball player does not give back a glove or in some cases bats. As a matter of fact I have my gloves from years ago at my parent's home. A baseball player plays many more games and potentially does much more traveling over a a similar period of time.

And most of all, whether you or others want to accept this fact, baseball when the World Series going on did not come up to the TV ratings or even a meaningless Monday Night Football game. Football is still very popular both college and pro and all these situations will do is prevent the fringe kid from playing for the most part. I do not see football going away at all. I do see it might not be played under high schools anymore, but that might happen for a lot of sports as club and other non-scholastic sports are becoming more and more popular. But the best athletes who are often inner-city kids are not going to stop playing football and replace it with soccer, baseball or lacrosse. If anything there might be more kids that play basketball and many football players play basketball already.

Peace

[Robert Goodman]

Yes, I strongly doubt it's going away, though it may wane somewhat in popularity. Football's been thru bad times before. Hard to believe it'd suffer horribly for long compared to skateboarding, bicycling, or psychedelics.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Robert Goodman

Yes, I strongly doubt it's going away, though it may wane somewhat in popularity. Football's been thru bad times before. Hard to believe it'd suffer horribly for long compared to skateboarding, bicycling, or psychedelics.

Remember the X-Games were supposed to take over the world and hardly anyone pays attention to those sports. Football is going no where.

Peace

[Canned Heat]

If these youth and high school coaches were held a little more accountable when they give their team equipment out too, a good portion of this would go away, IMO...along with teaching proper techniques.

Athletic trainers are working at high schools in our area and are now fitting most kids. The youth programs you still have kids picking out their favorite facemask pattern, regardless of how the helmet matches up on the kid and coaches are letting it slide or are too busy to follow thru with correct fittings. That stuff was going on even when I was a kid playing in the early 80s.