All but 2?

[Reffing Rev.]

Last night I subbed with a different crew. They've done state title games and the WH was great to work with, but ice got a question.

A 1st & Goal at B-10. B75 grabs and twists A1's face mask and A1 is tackled at B-11. The QB never loses the football.

All-but-one: Running Play, basic spot is end of run, half the distance from the 11, 1st and goal at B's 5.5, right?
WH said "we can't penalize A for lost yardage on a B foul" and have to enforce from the previous spot. He's the wh on this crew and he's a state finals official, that, and in this case were talking half a yard, so I dropped it.

I agree it should be that way, but in Fed it's not, right?

PS it was a great 1st game of the season 8-7 for a final score, fairly clean game with a total of 8 penalties.

[Robert Goodman]

Originally Posted by Reffing Rev.

Last night I subbed with a different crew. They've done state title games and the WH was great to work with, but ice got a question.

A 1st & Goal at B-10. B75 grabs and twists A1's face mask and A1 is tackled at B-11. The QB never loses the football.

All-but-one: Running Play, basic spot is end of run, half the distance from the 11, 1st and goal at B's 5.5, right?
WH said "we can't penalize A for lost yardage on a B foul" and have to enforce from the previous spot. He's the wh on this crew and he's a state finals official, that, and in this case were talking half a yard, so I dropped it.

I agree it should be that way, but in Fed it's not, right?

I don't agree it even should be the way the WH wanted it. The foul occurred after team A took the ball backwards a distance. If you let them have a gain that occurs before a foul, why not a loss?

[Rich]

Cause the foul is the direct reason they lost yards.

[Robert Goodman]

Originally Posted by Rich

Cause the foul is the direct reason they lost yards.

In this case that might be, if you assume the tackle would not have been made there w/o using the face mask as handle. Meanwhile in many tactical cases of fouls by the offense, the ball would've become dead midway between where it was & where the foul occurred.

[ajmc]

It may depend on which Rules Code you're dealing with. Under NFHS, the facemask PF penalty is from the end of the (related) run. Which ever side of the LOS/Previous spot things happen at.

Consider: a scrambles, 30 yards behind the LOS and is eventually tackled by the facemask. The penalty will only get him 15 yards of his scramble back, as well as getting to repeat the down.

[SouthGARef]

You were right. He was wrong.

We've all been in that situation - the experienced R that has a long resume that has a brain fart but thinks too much of himself to realize it. At some point all you can do is provide the correct information and let him ignore you.

[jTheUmp]

You were right on FED enforcement, your WH would've been right under NCAA rules.

Under NCAA, the rules assume Team A would've made it back to the LOS if B hadn't fouled.