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-   -   Box out or no call? (Video) (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/99166-box-out-no-call-video.html)

JRutledge Tue Jan 27, 2015 02:28am

Box out or no call? (Video)
 
<iframe width="420" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/KFD9J3DOupY" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

It took me a long time to find this video. Now the IHSA thankfully put on many of their State Final games.

Peace

AremRed Tue Jan 27, 2015 02:39am

Foul on white #42 for the undercut.

Camron Rust Tue Jan 27, 2015 02:49am

Foul on white. He pushed the player towards the basket while the shot was up then undercut him when he tried to jump for the rebound by bending over and backing under the red player. It is borderline intentional (F1). No play on the ball at all and created a dangerous situation....a non-basketball play.

La Rikardo Tue Jan 27, 2015 01:00pm

For me, in order to call a foul on a player for undercutting an opponent, I need to see a player jumping mostly vertically and the other player moving into his opponent's space. This is not what happened here.

Red #32 jumped into White #42. White #42 ducked in an attempt to avoid being contacted. For me, Red #32 is responsible for any contact that may occur, but in this case I believe the contact was incidental. No foul.

Welpe Tue Jan 27, 2015 01:03pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by AremRed (Post 952359)
Foul on white #42 for the undercut.

Yep.

BryanV21 Tue Jan 27, 2015 01:12pm

The red player appears to jump backwards... not straight up/vertical. And when coming down the white player landed on the red player, and the red player bent over... for whatever reason. So it looks like no-call. Although, the white player was pushing the red player under the basket while the ball was in the air.

However, I can see how the white player may have been pushing still while the red player jumped, thus making it look like the red player jumped backwards and not vertically.

I honestly can't tell. Guess you had to be there.

walt Tue Jan 27, 2015 01:14pm

LR, look at the feet of white #42. When the ball is shot and first caroms off the rim, his left foot is center lane. As he makes contact, he swings it all the way out toward the lane line which puts his butt under an airborne player. This is an undercut. Foul on white #42.

BryanV21 Tue Jan 27, 2015 01:16pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by walt (Post 952416)
LR, look at the feet of white #42. When the ball is shot and first caroms off the rim, his left foot is center lane. As he makes contact, he swings it all the way out toward the lane line which puts his butt under an airborne player. This is an undercut. Foul on white #42.

Good catch. I didn't see that until you pointed out his foot movement.

mutantducky Tue Jan 27, 2015 01:40pm

+1 foul.
I can see why the refs passed on it though as the commentators are saying.

Adam Tue Jan 27, 2015 02:02pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by La Rikardo (Post 952411)
For me, in order to call a foul on a player for undercutting an opponent, I need to see a player jumping mostly vertically and the other player moving into his opponent's space. This is not what happened here.

Red #32 jumped into White #42. White #42 ducked in an attempt to avoid being contacted. For me, Red #32 is responsible for any contact that may occur, but in this case I believe the contact was incidental. No foul.

For me, to call a foul on a player for undercutting, I need to see the opponent get undercut. Red may not be completely vertical in a labratory, but it's close enough in nature. I'm certainly not going to let white get away with the push and then the undercut.

I'm with Camron on this, I'd consider, but not likely go with, an intentional foul. White's only intent here is to undercut red.

VaTerp Tue Jan 27, 2015 02:08pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adam (Post 952436)
For me, to call a foul on a player for undercutting, I need to see the opponent get undercut. Red may not be completely vertical in a labratory, but it's close enough in nature. I'm certainly not going to let white get away with the push and then the undercut.

I'm with Camron on this, I'd consider, but not likely go with, an intentional foul. White's only intent here is to undercut red.

I would not consider going intentional here but agree on everything else.

This is a clear undercut and illegal displacement here. I dont understand why we would require a player to jump perfectly straight when another player is illegally taking his entire lower body out from under him.

Adam Tue Jan 27, 2015 02:12pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by VaTerp (Post 952440)
I would not consider going intentional here but agree on everything else.

This is a clear undercut and illegal displacement here. I dont understand why we would require a player to jump perfectly straight when another player is illegally taking his entire lower body out from under him.

I think if he did it again, I'd go with the intentional.

APG Tue Jan 27, 2015 02:13pm

I've got a foul for an undercut on white.

What I would have liked to have seen is the positioning of the officials in the play and see if they were in proper position to see this rebounding action. This seems like it'd be a pretty easy get for the slot to get.

Camron Rust Tue Jan 27, 2015 02:19pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by La Rikardo (Post 952411)
For me, in order to call a foul on a player for undercutting an opponent, I need to see a player jumping mostly vertically and the other player moving into his opponent's space. This is not what happened here.

Red #32 jumped into White #42. White #42 ducked in an attempt to avoid being contacted. For me, Red #32 is responsible for any contact that may occur, but in this case I believe the contact was incidental. No foul.

#42 bent over then proceeded to back himself underneath #32. That is a bush league play at best. He wasn't avoiding contact, he was being a troublemaker.

VaTerp Tue Jan 27, 2015 02:42pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adam (Post 952442)
I think if he did it again, I'd go with the intentional.

I can go along with that.

Its clearly a foul but I see it more as a poorly executed, and illegal, attempt to box out. I don't see it as the nefarious act you and Cameron are suggesting.


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