travel/fumble shot question

[mutantducky]

kind of hard to explain, I'd like to have a video of this.

A1 makes dribble drive then picks up the ball to gather himself for the shot several feet out, maybe a layup or a floater type shot. But he fumbles the ball without it hitting the ground. It goes up in the air. In doing so he takes an extra step, regains control and goes for the shot. Is this a travel?

I know you during a dribble you can go get a fumble. And same with a shot when it fumbles out of your hands. You can get it without dribbling again. In this one the fumble allowed him to take an extra step if I'm not counting control during the fumble. So instead of being a shot say 6 feet away, the fumble could allow him to take it in closer.

[mutantducky]

let me add this from the other thread
Actually it would be moot if the OP is a travel but if not..
So player is going to for shot as above, then does the fumble. During the fumble stage, or right after but before the shooting motion has begun again, A1 is fouled. Would this be a shooting foul or not?






NCAA-Men's memo dated February 17, 2014:

Play 2- A1 is dribbling the ball and attempts to turn the corner at the top of the key to drive down the lane. B1 fouls A1 as A1 picks up his dribble. A1 then steps with his right foot and then pushes off with his left foot before beginning to raise his arm(s) or hand(s) to release the ball for a layup. The try is successful.

Ruling- The foul occurred before the act of shooting began. Therefore, the goal should not count. Charge B1 with a personal foul and shoot appropriate free throws if Team A is in the bonus. Rule 5-1.10 and 4-8.1.

Comment-The language of 5-1.10, “The try starts when the player begins the motion that normally precedes the release of the ball”, refers to the hand(s)/arm(s) in preparing to release the ball on a try for goal. Examples of the act of shooting motion includes raising the ball with the hand(s) and/or arms to shoot a layup or jump shot or the downward motion of the hand(s) or arm(s) in completing a dunk or alley-oop play. This act of shooting motion does not include but is not limited to picking up the dribble, catching (gathering) the ball, or advancing on the court with one or both feet

[Nevadaref]

A player can only travel while holding the ball (with one Case Book exception). So what you describe cannot be a traveling violation.

It may be an illegal dribble, since the player did not allow the ball to contact the floor before touching it again.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

It may be an illegal dribble, since the player did not allow the ball to contact the floor before touching it again.

(NFHS) I thought that a player could always recover a fumble?

[Nevadaref]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

(NFHS) I thought that a player could always recover a fumble?

The problem is going to be that the official must ajudge if the action is a fumble or a tossing of the ball.

If it is a true fumble, which accidentally slipped from the player's grasp, he can retreive the ball.

[mutantducky]

this is a true fumble, but it is giving the player an advantage to get nearer. But nothing against the rules so apparently legal. The one I had was not a fumble down. it 'squirmed' upward.
Just imagine, dribbling with your left hand, then you see that you will start to commence the shot, so your right hand comes over. You will be taking a step then jumping for the layup. So at this point two hands on the ball so travel/pivot rule in effect, but then right after the grab the ball goes up in the air a little bit. The player takes an extra step during this phase to regain control and then goes for the shot.
Would be an unusual play, it just would look awkward and I'm sure there would be a lot of people yelling for travel.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

(NFHS) I thought that a player could always recover a fumble?

Rule reference?

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by mutantducky

this is a true fumble, but it is giving the player an advantage to get nearer.

It also gives the defense an advantage because it's easier to steal / deflect the loose ball.

It's legal, and it's not a shooting foul.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

The problem is going to be that the official must judge if the action is a fumble or a tossing of the ball.

I thought that is was very clear that this was a fumble:

Originally Posted by mutantducky

... he fumbles the ball without it hitting the ground. It goes up in the air. In doing so he takes an extra step, regains control and goes for the shot. Is this a travel?

Of course, the "goes for a shot" statement can lead to a lot of questions.