Musings from my Officials Staff Mtg
 

Attending our officials staff mtg last night. It was both interesting and coincidental. Interesting to hear the conveners talk about: 1) new FT rule;
2) they went over a few of your more commonly mis-understood rules (your usual suspects e.g., high dribble vs palming, block/charge/blarge, and issues of verticality),
3) also discussing that we should really manage the issue of "lane over-reaching"--when players in lane spaces during FT's will arm tangle prior to boxing out.
4) did you'all know that if the FT shooter gets boxed out and physically touched by a lane space occupier while the ball is in flight, then it is a common foul on said defender? News to me.

It was coincidental to the extent that some of the issues we discussed on this Forum were also brought up. I actually asked the convener about "allowing defenders to wedge betw offensive players on stack formation throw ins". The convener said, if the offensive player have already obtained their positions, then the defenders have no right trying to wedge between them.
In closing the conveners told us verbatim "blow your whistles more often and early".

The local middle schools play girls basketball as a fall sport here. during my games, my partners (and in turn myself) talked to the players about this. Last year, I even called a double-foul when two girls got overzealous with their jostling.

If I'm reading this correctly, any contact on the shooter while the ball is still in flight is to be called a foul in your part of Rome? :confused:

I can't find the recent thread discussing what might be this very issue. It used to be the case that this was the rule the last time players in the lane space could enter on the release. But with the new rule change allowing this again, there has been no corresponding addition of language that would make what was described in #4 a foul unless it was more than incidental contact.

Our first association meeting is Monday. I hope we have some good discussion on some of these topics as well.

No, it wasn't the case before. Before, it was a lane violation on the defender.

Thanks, Adam. I stand corrected.

So any contact is a foul? That's news to me too. Must be one of those new "automatic" fouls. :cool:

Boom Goes The Dynamite ...
 

1) http://forum.officiating.com/basketb...tml#post943262

2) http://forum.officiating.com/basketb...tml#post943300

And among other things that the conveners alerted/warned us about was that, and this was verbatim: "Officials please be aware that many people/fans are videotaping/recording your games with their cell phones and are anxious to have video of you acting unprofessionally. I [one of the conveners said] at times will get a video from a parent / fan of a game and they want to discuss with me your actions. Please be professional and be careful about what you do in the parking lot--and I'll leave it at that."

Are y'all breaking out the moonshine and corn liquor when you get to the car?

Absolutely not. We wait till we hit the road outside the parking lot to open up the cooler.

:p

I've been on that trip.

Back when I started officiating in the late 1980s, the length of a road trip was measured in the number of six packs you'd get for the ride home.

Thankfully, those days are long over.

In most areas of the country anyways...

+1

Send some of the folks you work with to the Forum. That'll remind them all the video that APG and I - as well as others - post has to come from somewhere.

*I sure will do that. I've told them all about your fine website here.

You mean this video?

Cooler? When I was where you are now, we used the snow bank as our cooler. :p I remember doing some digging when I couldn't remember exactly where we buried the treasure. :D

Still people that feel that way. I am not one of them, but I know people that insist on doing just that.

Peace

What year did the rule change to enter the lane when the ball hits the rim/backboard? I thought it was a foul if there was contact with the Free Throw shooter before the ball hit the rim.
I brought up this discussion back in June when the rule changes were announced.

It used to be a rule that it was a violation to break the plane of the FT line before the ball hit. That did not make it back to the rule book this year.

He Said, She Said ???
 

http://forum.officiating.com/basketb...tml#post941796

I'm still having trouble tracking this down, but the last that I heard, from my local interpreter, was that IAABO contacted the NFHS regarding the absence of this in the current rulebook, and received a response from the NFHS that this rule should still be utilized.

I'm 100% sure that we are utilizing this rule here in my little corner of Connecticut, and I'm almost positive that we are using this rule throughout the entire Constitution State. I'm not sure what Peter Webb is doing with IAABO "International".

As I stated earlier, I'm having trouble tracking this down. It's like I need to know a secret handshake to get any factual information.

Actually it did. It wasn't in the rule book when it was first published, but when all of the corrections were published, they included the wording without highlighting it ...

Page 70, 9.1 Comment - Sentence two (2) should read: Once a free throw begins no player may enter or leave a marked free throw lane line space or break, with either foot, the vertical plane of the free throw lane line or marked lane space boundary prior to the release of the ball by the free thrower.

A subtle change in wording that makes a difference.

IAABO published the following caseplay at the beginning of the Fall and included it in the last Sportorial ...

Free thrower A1 releases the try. B3, occupying a free throw lane line space moves into the free throw lane to “box-out” A1, then breaks the vertical plane of the outside edge of the free throw line with a foot or feet prior to the ball contacting the backboard or the ring. Ruling: Violation by B3. (9.1.3g)

You highlighted the wrong part.

In the play being discussed, B4 (or whoever) doesn't cross the FT line to "box out" the FT shooter until after the ball has been released.

[QUOTE=PG_Ref;944260]Actually it did. It wasn't in the rule book when it was first published, but when all of the corrections were published, they included the wording without highlighting it ...

Page 70, 9.1 Comment - Sentence two (2) should read: Once a free throw begins no player may enter or leave a marked free throw lane line space or break, with either foot, the vertical plane of the free throw lane line or marked lane space boundary prior to the release of the ball by the free thrower.

A subtle change in wording that makes a difference.[/QUOTE
This comment just says you can't break the plane of the free throw line until the ball is released. Doesn't say you have to wait til ball hits rim to cross plane of FT line. in old days, when you could enter the lane on release, you had to wait til ball hit rim to actually then cross free throw line. The IAABO play you have below says it but I haven't seen anything from NFHS, either in rules or comments, to support that play....it cites 9.1.3g but that rule doesn't say that..thx

Yeah, I know it's after the ball was released. But, what they are saying is that if B4 crosses the free-throw line before it hits backboard or ring, it should be ruled a violation.

I'm not sure who you mean by "they." If it's IAABO, I accept that they are saying this. But, they aren't getting it from the reading of the rule. In our (non-IAABO) state, it is NOT a violation.

If you mean "NFHS", then I disagree that they are saying this should be a violation. They might have meant to say that, and it wouldn't be the first time that what they said is not what they meant (or vice versa).

Yes, "they" being IAABO ... since Peter Webb is now a part of the NFHS rules committee.

Letter to IAABO
 

This was my question/Statement to IAABO.
I do not understand the Ruling reference to the 3rd paragraph under 'Rules Reminders & Interpretations'. Rule 9-1-3g does not justify the violation to B3. Many years ago when the players in a markes lane space could enter the lane on the release of the Free Thrower, there was a restriction stating they could not break the Free Throw line, nor make contact with the Free Throw shooter before the ball contacted the rim. That rule went away when ALL players were restricted to move until the ball contacted the rim
As you are aware, the free thrower is restricted to the free throw semi-circle until the ball contacts the backboard or basket ring.

This is the response from Pete Webb
The free throw semi-circle is "off limits" to all other players until the ball contacts the backboard or basket ring.

The players located in marked free throw lane line spaces along the free throw
lane line may enter the free throw lane, upon the free thrower's release of the
free throw. Those players may not, with their foot, break the outside edge of the free throw line until the ball contacts the backboard or basket ring.

Chances are that the rule will be edited (re-written) for 2015-16

I wanted to reply saying if there is nothing saying it is wrong, then it must be OK.

I wished. I also do football and we have a quarterfinal tonight, and it is 178 miles one way!

Free Throw Line ...
 

The free throw lane line is not the same as the free throw line. This caseplay correction is irrelevant to the question about a defender along the lane crossing the free throw line to box out the shooter before the ball hits the rim, or backboard.

From The Horse's Mouth ...
 

Zoochy must know the secret handshake.

Since Connecticut is a 100% IAABO state, then this is all that I need to start my season with a clear understanding of the rule.

But I would still like to know what role the NFHS played in this debacle.

So if a defender from the marked lane spaces breaks the plane of the free throw line and/or contacts the free thrower, this is a violation? Just want to hammer this home.

According to IAABO authorities, yes. Check with your local board for a definitive answer.

Yes. And No.

Depends on your state.

My association in central Ohio is going with no violation.

Even if it is a violation Peter Webb doesn't state whether it is a FT violation or a floor violation. Poor BillyMac isn't going to know whether to award a throw-in or a substitute FT.
Additionally, would it be a delayed FT violation or is it like an excessive elbow swinging violation which gets called and penalized even if the try is successful?

Delayed Violation ...
 

Here's the text of the Power Point slide:

If the defender along the free throw lane line breaks the plane of the free throw line, a violation has occurred. Use delayed violation signal. Hold whistle until free throw is completed. If free throw is made, ignore violation; if free throw is missed, award a replacement free throw. (9-1-3-B)