NC State at Syracuse ending
 

A. PC foul on Syracuse guard.
B. Foul by Syracuse after long pass.

1. In the act of shooting?
2. Flagrant 1 (NFHS intentional personal)?

C. Lead calling BI on final hoop.

Video request
 

BI by Lead was the right official calling it since the hand came up through the basket.

I'm more interest in the play at 41.4 seconds of the 2nd half when the Trail comes very late with foul call after Lead had already signaled OOBs.

Video added (all 4 plays requested)
 

All of the plays are on this clip in chronological order. There's only one replay of the BI because there was only one angle where we can see the officials' positions.


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I think a patient whistle on #3 would have been withheld in the end. Other than that, I agree with the other three calls.

The OOB/foul play bothers me. One it looks bad and two the contact was well after the shot was blocked. The Hightowerish theatrics after the foul call and BI could be toned down as well.

On the Syracuse PC foul, right before that even at game speed guard committed a dribbling violation. Ball rested in his hands. Anyone see that?

As far as Nevada's play C (#3 on video), Art Hyland will be coming out with a new NCAA-Men's interpretation of "shooting/continuous motion". Upward motion is going to be defined as the beginning of the habitual shooting motion.

I was going to comment also that the PC contact was proceeding by a palming violation.

In the pre-game , do officials discuss what they will call and not call let's say in the last 4 minutes of the game ? That dribbling was so obvious. The C and L could if easily picked that up.

Play 1: Block, defender got hand level to the ball.

Play 2: PC

Play 3: Count it.

Play 4: Good call. I'm fine with Lead helping in transition.

#1. Even if there was a foul, the right team got the ball back and there was no need to come in like that after the OOB call.

#2. Great PC (preceeded by a carry).

#3. Basket should have been counted. NO WAY I'm taking away those points.

#4. Good call....even by lead given the fact that the C and T were probably still way behind the play.

I agree on all four. It seems, by the timing/cadence of the call by T, that his call was on #14, and he was convinced that L's call only involved the block by #24. Even so, I'd hopefully leave it alone, as Camron said.

On #4 the C wasn't behind the play at all. He was below the FTLE when the violation took place.

Yes, he was in good position, and he also called the basket interference. But when it involves a hand going up through the net, I have no problem with the Lead having a whistle.

C was in position, but in transition there is no guarantee that he would be, unlike a half-court situation where the off-ball official will nearly always be in position. During transition I think this call is fair game to Lead.

1. I have no problem coming in with a foul. If he saw something up top, that is a good call to make.

2. PC Foul all the way.

3. Basket should have counted. The ball handler gathers and never puts the ball back on the floor after being fouled.

4. In transition usually is a time the L can make that call. But he was also already on the end line, so I am not sure why he made that call. But it appeared to be the right call.

Peace

I'm fine with the call, I would not have made it.

PC foul, the C made me laugh, cause he didn't hold up a fist, but he does a funny kind of dance that seems to agree with his partner's call.

From his angle, it would be hard to see if the habitual motion had begun.

The C has the play, his hand is up and I'm sure he's wondering why the Lead has this. Stevie Wonder can see this one.

My thoughts:
1. Leave it alone and the Lead handle this play.

2. Clear PC for the push-off. Nice call and would like to see this made more often.

3. Absolutely in the act of shooting. At the NFHS level, I'm calling this an intentional personal foul. The foul negates an obvious advantageous position by the offensive player.

4. Let the C have this call, which he did. As the Lead, come get it if no call is made by a partner. This is an absolute must have as it is game critical. I don't like the showboating mechanic by the Lead, but I understand why he jumped on this play. The situation in the game (score and time remaining) may have warranted a faster whistle here than any other help situation during a contest.

Isn't the "obvious advantageous position" in this play making the shot??

Now if the defender wraps up the guy from behind so he can neither shoot nor move, then we can talk INT/Flagrant.

I also think it was continuous motion and only a common foul. He attempted to play the ball and didn't clobber the guy, so for me this is an basket plus a free throw. All the other play I agree with. I thought the foul by #14 was a good get by C. My resolution wasn't great so I guess it could have been a block.

Wouldn't even enter my mind. I would score the goal, though. I'm also a big fan of having a patient whistle and getting the foul on the shot whenever possible.

I wouldn't have an intentional here either. It's not excessive contact and I think he is making a clumsy, off balance play on the ball.

Excessive contact would not be the reason to justify an intentional foul here.

Let me ask you these questions:
Is this a breakaway?
Does the offensive player have an obvious advantageous position?
Do you believe that the defender purposely fouls in an attempt to prevent an easy basket?

Now go check the rule.

I'm usually pretty quick to count a basket, and at first look, I would have counted it. However, from the endline camera, it doesn't look to me like he had controlled the ball when he got bumped. Maybe I'm just giving deference to the official on the spot, though. Frankly, I would like to think I'd have passed on that one altogether.

As for Nevada's 3rd question:

No

Same...it doesn't even enter my mind as a possibility on this one. He swiped at the ball. He got arm instead of ball. Now if he had held onto that arm so the shooter couldn't get his arms up at all, then I'd go IF, but he has to do something more than just foul from a poor position.

3. Not intentional.

Didn't watch the others.

In your opinion or according to the rule as written?

Precisely why I ruled it out.

No. It's a clumsy, off balance play on the ball.

According to the rule.

The Trail official saw the illegal contact on the shooter, looked to see if the Lead was calling the foul, then when clear that the Lead DID NOT SEE IT, came in with a VERY STRONG whistle (which he ABSOLUTELY should in this situation) and sold the call.

I'll be the Lead was glad that Trail came and got that one right.

btw, can we stop with the criticism of the "showboating/theatrics" by the officials in this game?

This is a high-level game being played in a football stadium in front of 30,000+ people at the most intense part of the game. In each of the calls made in the video, the officials "matched the moment" with their mechanics/strength of calls.....

What you or I do in a high-school/small college gym in front of 100 people "ain't gonna work" here.

I fully agree with this. Make the call match the play.

I also think we're trained to be a little too subdued in HS but that's an argument for another day.

Absolutely. Probably louder than most of us could ever imagine. He was trying to get his partner's attention and let him know he had a foul. I see very little problem with that kind of action in that moment.

Peace

Not sure what video you were watching but in no way did he wait for lead. He almost immediately hit the whistle with a fist and then repeated put it up and down.

On the BI he came off the endline almost to the 28 foot mark, again repeatedly dropping the it counts signal.

In no way was it rising to the moment, it was all about look at me make this call.

Uhh? In Play #1, the Lead has signaled OOB before his fist comes up.

Play #4 stops and he hasn't even crossed the FTLE.

I would say you are the one trying to sell something. ;)

He who, the L? On Play #4 when the violation is committed the L is at the endline and the C is below the FTLE.

watch the video angle from behind the Trail official....he watches the play, sees the contact, looks to his left (actually leans a little bit) to see what the Lead is going to call...AND AFTER THE LEAD SIGNALS THE BALL OUT OF BOUNDS, the Trail comes in with a VERY STRONG whistle.

take another look....it's on the video!

Read what BZ posted. I'm responding to his comment about Play #4. He said the Lead ran out to the 28' line signaling BI.

He didn't go as far as BZ said but he did run out to near the FTLE by the time the clip stopped. Not sure how much farther he went after the clip. Maybe BZ saw a more complete clip elsewhere.

Regardless of whether it was the FLTE or the 28' mark, he went overboard on the theatrics.

I agree with all the calls with one caveat. #3 I could go either way on it. From the end line camera I am not sure the offensive player had gathered the ball even though he clearly does after the foul and does not dribble again. I would probably have counted it at game speed but I am ok with the "no shot" ruling by the official after watching the video.

On #1, that is a good cadence whistle and he sells it appropriately. After seeing the leads calling the OOB he immediately hits the whistle, just behind leads call.

Uh, no.

I believe Syracuse had a foul to give, and were trying to give it. You are saying you would not call this?

In the third play, how much you guys wanna bet the Lead yelled "ON THE FLOOR!!!" while pointing to the ground??

Here's my thing... If the trail saw the illegal contact, why did he not put a whistle on it at the time of the illegal contact? We are not allowed to use the advantage/disadvantage at the NCAA level this year. This is a play where I can see the T having a whistle anyways, so why didn't he come in earlier with the foul?

He wouldn't have had to sell it so hard had he put a whistle on it earlier...

I'm probably no-calling it for the first 30 minutes. I imagine I'd no-call it during the last 10 seconds, also. I'm not taking away a breakaway layup on that bump if the shooter ends up keeping control (like in this play).

If I blew the whistle, I'd regret it.

So has the NCAA completely disregarded the incidental contact rules? A/D is simply a way of wording that. I highly doubt they want every bit of contact called a foul.

While I agree he might not have to have sold it as hard as he did, it is a good cadence whistle since the Lead is primary on the play. He is a split second after he sees Lead calling it OOB. I don't think it was an advantage/disadvantage thing as much as a secondary coverage whistle.

What if he misses the layup?

He had a wide open layup, that tells me the contact didn't impede him from doing anything. He should make that layup.

Now, if the layup was made more difficult by the bump, call it and give him the 1 & 1. We hold our whistles all the time on a defender who bumps a player who is driving right past him. How is this different?