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-   -   What is the call? (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/95436-what-call.html)

BigT Wed Jul 03, 2013 01:54pm

What is the call?
 
Had a play in a championship (7th grade) national tournament in SLC.

5 point game with 15 seconds left and the home team is up by 5. The ball is coming into play on the end line. H5 is moving in the key to get open. V5 push him out of his route twice then two hands off balance and he falls to the floor with the physicality. I am lead doing my count watching the contact and the ball has not been released as V1 watches his center crash in the key.

Is this a dead ball technical or an intentional foul. Thanks in advance,

BigT Wed Jul 03, 2013 01:56pm

The play before this one was I was trail on a fast break. H4 is ahead of his man on a fast break and V4 cant stop him from getting a lay up. He falls into his feet tripping him and causing H4 to head plant and get hurt. My partner came up with an intentional foul.

Adam Wed Jul 03, 2013 01:59pm

When does the ball become live after a made basket?

Raymond Wed Jul 03, 2013 02:05pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigT (Post 899223)
Had a play in a championship (7th grade) national tournament in SLC.

5 point game with 15 seconds left and the home team is up by 5. The ball is coming into play on the end line. H5 is moving in the key to get open. V5 push him out of his route twice then two hands off balance and he falls to the floor with the physicality. I am lead doing my count watching the contact and the ball has not been released as V1 watches his center crash in the key.

Is this a dead ball technical or an intentional foul. Thanks in advance,

Do you believe the ball was dead or live?

BigT Wed Jul 03, 2013 02:21pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adam (Post 899225)
When does the ball become live after a made basket?

The ball becomes live when it has been gathered after a made basket. My OP is after a foul shots I am handing the ball to a player for a throw in.

BigT Wed Jul 03, 2013 02:22pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef (Post 899226)
Do you believe the ball was dead or live?

I believe it was live. I believe it is just an intentional foul. Want to make sure as I have never made this call before.

JRutledge Wed Jul 03, 2013 02:24pm

Well if all this took place during the live ball, it cannot be a technical. It could be an intentional if you feel it fit the definition, but hard to tell by your description.

This is why we get paid the big bucks, not make the hard decisions.

Peace

bob jenkins Wed Jul 03, 2013 02:26pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigT (Post 899228)
I believe it was live. I believe it is just an intentional foul. Want to make sure as I have never made this call before.

As far as I can tell, it's just a common foul.

If the ball was dead then the contact would be ignored unless it was I or F, so if you wanted to have a foul, it would have to be an IT or an FT.

Raymond Wed Jul 03, 2013 02:29pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigT (Post 899228)
I believe it was live. I believe it is just an intentional foul. Want to make sure as I have never made this call before.

Just helping you think through the process.

After a made basket we begin a count when the ball is at the disposal of the thrower-in.

After a stoppage in play (violation/foul/intermission/time-out/inadvertent whistle) we hand/bounce the ball to the thrower-in at which point the ball is immediately considered at the disposal of the thrower-in.

At what point is the ball considered live during a throw-in?

OKREF Wed Jul 03, 2013 05:36pm

Intentional

Adam Wed Jul 03, 2013 05:57pm

In the normal course of the game, this is quite possibly just a common defensive personal foul. In this situation, I'm pretty likely to get the first push on V5 to stop the situation from escalating. If it's clear they're just trying to foul to keep the clock from starting, you might want to consider an intentional personal foul on V5.

I'd have to see it to know for sure on that aspect, but either way, it's clearly a personal foul because you had started your 5 second count.

Camron Rust Wed Jul 03, 2013 08:30pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigT (Post 899227)
The ball becomes live when it has been gathered after a made basket. My OP is after a foul shots I am handing the ball to a player for a throw in.

Only if the player doing the gathering is also OOB in a position to make the throw or has had enough time that they should have been.

Camron Rust Wed Jul 03, 2013 08:32pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by bob jenkins (Post 899230)
As far as I can tell, it's just a common foul.

Agree. I just don't see anything in the description that suggests otherwise.

BktBallRef Wed Jul 03, 2013 10:09pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigT (Post 899227)
My OP is after a foul shots I am handing the ball to a player for a throw in.

Why?

And yes, if you judged the foul merits an INT call, that would be the correct call since the ball is live.

just another ref Wed Jul 03, 2013 11:26pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigT (Post 899227)
The ball becomes live when it has been gathered after a made basket. My OP is after a foul shots I am handing the ball to a player for a throw in.

Why were you handling the ball after foul shots?


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