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JetMetFan Sun Apr 21, 2013 02:52pm

Last-second shot
 
Two things on this one...

1. Thoughts on what the C saw/heard that would have led to the call.
2. If you're the C and your partners come over immediately, do you change it?

<iframe width="896" height="504" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/DUJZ1Hu7PSc?rel=0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

OKREF Sun Apr 21, 2013 03:11pm

That's not even close. Clearly good in my opinion.

JRutledge Sun Apr 21, 2013 03:11pm

Maybe he was not paying that close attention and guessed? Otherwise I do not recall hearing a horn before the release of the shot. And yes if my partner had information I would be willing to change the call if I was totally wrong. But this was easy. And his mechanics did not show he was sure.

Peace

Camron Rust Sun Apr 21, 2013 03:51pm

Not sure why he could possibly be calling it off. That horn was well after the release. Maybe he's under the impression it has to hit the rim before the horn????

BillyMac Sun Apr 21, 2013 06:51pm

Count Dracula ...
 
Why did he indicate that it was a three pointer if he wasn't going to count it?

deecee Sun Apr 21, 2013 07:26pm

Ouch, not even close. To answer your 2 questions.

1. I have no frickin clue.
2. Ill listen to what my partner has to say and depending on his information mixed with my confidence of the call it depends. I mean I've had partners run over to tell me something that was right because they had a crappy angle and missed what happened later or on 50/50 calls (ie. strong side rebounding action pass on foul and award ball OOB where they come in and say, "didn't you see it hit red #xx" and I say, "didnt you see the foul on white #xx that i passed on"), so it depends.
2a. It also depends on my confidence with my partner.

Raymond Sun Apr 21, 2013 08:18pm

This a play where the 2 other officials cannot be afraid of hurting their partner's feelings.

I once had a bonehead play where I waved off an end of 1st quarter shot as the tableside trail. When I started off the halftime discussion by immediately apologizing to the crew, both my partners said I got it wrong. I really wished one those two would have stepped up when I made the call instead of waiting until we were in the locker room.

JetMetFan Sun Apr 21, 2013 09:05pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by BillyMac (Post 891597)
Why did he indicate that it was a three pointer if he wasn't going to count it?

I was wondering who'd be the first to point that out. It didn't make sense to me that he went up with the three signal then changed to waving off the shot.

AremRed Sun Apr 21, 2013 09:46pm

Wow. What the heck is that guy doing? Maybe he thought he saw a travel? I can't think of any other reason to wave off the shot. It was clearly released in time, by at least a second. Also, I counted 10 wave-offs. How many does one need??

JRutledge Sun Apr 21, 2013 09:52pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by JetMetFan (Post 891618)
I was wondering who'd be the first to point that out. It didn't make sense to me that he went up with the three signal then changed to waving off the shot.

I do not see that as a big deal. He knows it is going to be a 3 point shot so I can understand the instinct to do that. But he never got the hand that high for that signal. I am more surprised why he waved off the shot than that little insignificant detail.

Peace

JetMetFan Sun Apr 21, 2013 11:41pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by JRutledge (Post 891627)
I do not see that as a big deal. He knows it is going to be a 3 point shot so I can understand the instinct to do that. But he never got the hand that high for that signal. I am more surprised why he waved off the shot than that little insignificant detail.

Peace

It's not significant, just odd since this is an either/or situation. Either the shot was released on time or it wasn't. There's no reason to signal it's an attempt if it actually came after the horn. It seems as though in the second it took him to change he somehow talked himself out of the shot being released in time.

On another front: We can't see the full huddle on camera but I'd like to think the L would've been the one to give the strongest argument for the goal to count. He's the one guy who didn't have any players to watch in the sequence.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Camron Rust (Post 891580)
Not sure why he could possibly be calling it off. That horn was well after the release. Maybe he's under the impression it has to hit the rim before the horn????

Camron, I had that thought as well. Then I thought, "Nah, there's no way someone could really think that, could they?" But that might actually explain why he started signalling the three and then brought it down.

Nevadaref Mon Apr 22, 2013 12:13am

Quote:

Originally Posted by deecee (Post 891599)
Ouch, not even close. To answer your 2 questions.

1. I have no frickin clue.
2. ...pass on foul and award ball OOB where they come in and say, "didn't you see it hit red #xx" and I say, "didnt you see the foul on white #xx that i passed on"), so it depends.
2a. It also depends on my confidence with my partner.

Why would you EVER pass on a foul? (Your words.) I understand passing on contact if it doesn't cause a disadvantage, but what you wrote is just bizarre.
Please either call a foul or award the ball to the team which didn't touch it last.

Doing otherwise is unfair.

HokiePaul Mon Apr 22, 2013 07:26am

I think he (incorrectly) thinks the ball hit the basket support after the initial bounce. That explains the 3 point signal and wave off.

HokiePaul Mon Apr 22, 2013 07:29am

Quote:

Originally Posted by HokiePaul (Post 891653)
I think he (incorrectly) thinks the ball hit the basket support after the initial bounce. That explains the 3 point signal and wave off.

nevermind ... I see one angle where he begins to wave off the shot before the ball hits the rim ... I'm not sure what he's thinking either.

Anyone know how this was resolved ... It looks like he was going to discuss with the Trail. Was the call changed?

deecee Mon Apr 22, 2013 09:07am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nevadaref (Post 891636)
Why would you EVER pass on a foul? (Your words.) I understand passing on contact if it doesn't cause a disadvantage, but what you wrote is just bizarre.
Please either call a foul or award the ball to the team which didn't touch it last.

Doing otherwise is unfair.

I meant on passing on contact that could be a foul depending on advantage/disadvantage.

Adam Mon Apr 22, 2013 09:10am

Quote:

Originally Posted by JRutledge (Post 891627)
I do not see that as a big deal. He knows it is going to be a 3 point shot so I can understand the instinct to do that. But he never got the hand that high for that signal. I am more surprised why he waved off the shot than that little insignificant detail.

Peace

Agreed. I'll put a 3 up, because often times they get their feet set and start their motion before the horn even if the shot is late.

Adam Mon Apr 22, 2013 09:13am

Quote:

Originally Posted by deecee (Post 891671)
I meant on passing on contact that could be a foul depending on advantage/disadvantage.

That is completely the opposite of what you said. You said you'd pass on the foul and give the ball to the wrong team. The old "saving a foul" mentality. If that's expected in your area (and it may well be), that's fine. But there's no point in trying to change what you said. That's not an advantage/disadvantage call. If anything, you're applying the A/D to the OOB play and just skipping the foul to give the ball to the right team.

No rules backing for this, but there may be this expectation where you work.

JetMetFan Mon Apr 22, 2013 09:13am

Quote:

Originally Posted by HokiePaul (Post 891654)
Anyone know how this was resolved ... It looks like he was going to discuss with the Trail. Was the call changed?

I guess I should've mentioned that in the OP.

Nope, the call was not changed.

Raymond Mon Apr 22, 2013 09:15am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adam (Post 891678)
That is completely the opposite of what you said. You said you'd pass on the foul and give the ball to the wrong team. The old "saving a foul" mentality. If that's expected in your area (and it may well be), that's fine. But there's no point in trying to change what you said. That's not an advantage/disadvantage call. If anything, you're applying the A/D to the OOB play and just skipping the foul to give the ball to the right team.

No rules backing for this, but there may be this expectation where you work.

From what I've seen that expectation has gone away b/c of......what for it........YouTube.

JRutledge Tue Apr 23, 2013 12:43am

Quote:

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef (Post 891681)
From what I've seen that expectation has gone away b/c of......what for it........YouTube.

Yep, too many phone cameras. ;)

Peace


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