Wow. Take a look at this...

[Brad]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

The only explanation of this is that the broadcast equipment was maladjusted....or the image was of a different clock in the arena (perhaps on the other end) and the in arena clocks were not in sync with each other.

The NBA found that long cable lengths could actually cause a delay in their systems which resulted in the clocks and LEDs being out of sync. They make adjustments to compensate for this problem.

It's definitely possible that the clock in the arena is out of sync with the LEDs by 0.1 seconds —*I think that is likely the case here.

[JetMetFan]

Originally Posted by Brad

The NBA found that long cable lengths could actually cause a delay in their systems which resulted in the clocks and LEDs being out of sync. They make adjustments to compensate for this problem.

It's definitely possible that the clock in the arena is out of sync with the LEDs by 0.1 seconds —*I think that is likely the case here.

It's physics. The signal dissipates the longer the cable run. That's why the clocks on the backboard will be slightly a head of a clock that's overhead or those on a balcony. I haven't been in Westchester Co. Arena - where this game was played - but my guess is the camera clock was on the overhead device. If it had been on one of the backboard clocks everything would have been in sync as far as the broadcast was concerned since those hit 0.0 as the LEDs came on.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by Brad

The NBA found that long cable lengths could actually cause a delay in their systems which resulted in the clocks and LEDs being out of sync. They make adjustments to compensate for this problem.

It's definitely possible that the clock in the arena is out of sync with the LEDs by 0.1 seconds —*I think that is likely the case here.

Originally Posted by JetMetFan

It's physics. The signal dissipates the longer the cable run. That's why the clocks on the backboard will be slightly a head of a clock that's overhead or those on a balcony. I haven't been in Westchester Co. Arena - where this game was played - but my guess is the camera clock was on the overhead device. If it had been on one of the backboard clocks everything would have been in sync as far as the broadcast was concerned since those hit 0.0 as the LEDs came on.

I can tell you one thing for certain, it isn't the length of the cables. And you'd know that if you understood physics.

Cables are dramatically faster than that at any length possible in even the largest arena...unless they're using the worst cables ever made.

Let say the cables in an arena in New York were routed to Chicago and back before going to the a scoreboard. That is about 1600 miles round trip (about 3 millions meters). Typical networking cable propagation times are about 500 nanoseconds per 100 meters. If you do the math (just approximating here), it takes about 15/1000 of one second to go from New York to Chicago and back. You could even go back and forth between the two cities about 6-7 times before you get 0.1 second of delay.

Even if you don't want to to the math, just think of phone calls. If you could get 0.1 second of cable delay inside of a building (worst case of 1000m) and you were on the phone in New York, you'd have to wait over 5 minutes to hear what your friend in LA says. And then they'd have to wait 5 more minutes to hear your response. Do you recall any telephones that work that way?

For that matter, you can send a signal to the moon in under 1 second (sure it is radio, but the speeds are on the same order of magnitude).

[JetMetFan]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

I can tell you one thing for certain, it isn't the length of the cables. And you'd know that if you understood physics.

Cables are dramatically faster than that at any length possible in even the largest arena...unless they're using the worst cables ever made.

Camron, trust me, I understand physics. I also work in television. The type of cables you're talking about aren't the same type of cables used to wire up the timing devices in an arena, especially an older building like Westchester County Arena.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by JetMetFan

Camron, trust me, I understand physics. I also work in television. The type of cables you're talking about aren't the same type of cables used to wire up the timing devices in an arena, especially an older building like Westchester County Arena.

I'm talking basic low-grade networking cable, costs pennies, nothing fancy. The cable just isn't going to make the difference when we're talking about a tenth of a second. There may be differences in the system that causes delays, but isn't the cables. And yes, I design high speed electronics for a living and it actually involves dealing with delays on wires.

[SamG]

If you can transmit and receive from a satellite in <.25 (1/4 second), and the distance is 45,000 miles to make that trip (22,500 one way), I highly doubt even 2000 feet of cable is going to "slow down" a picture.

Here's the other thing to think about... as long as the camera shooting the action and the camera shooting the clock are both "delayed" (right, that's what you're saying, that the cable distance affects speed), then they're still in sync.

They could both be delayed 10 seconds, but as long as they're in sync they're accurate.

And another thought... broadcasts (from college to pro) are used all the time to review last second shots. They use the same technology that was shown in the reply (game/shot clock superimposed over game camera). If the system is inaccurate, why use it?

[APG]

Originally Posted by SamG

And another thought... broadcasts (from college to pro) are used all the time to review last second shots. They use the same technology that was shown in the reply (game/shot clock superimposed over game camera). If the system is inaccurate, why use it?

I know, at least in the NBA, they aren't using superimposed clocks. Since the game clock is the first clock of importance when determining the end of the period in the NBA, they're using shots with the game clock in the view of the camera (followed by LED lights which is next on the list when determining end of period/shot clock period).

[Brad]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

I can tell you one thing for certain, it isn't the length of the cables. And you'd know that if you understood physics.

I was really just passing on what I had been told, right or wrong ... I did not do my own empirical testing!