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-   -   More Block/PC plays from CA...3 of them (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/93995-more-block-pc-plays-ca-3-them.html)

BillyMac Wed Feb 13, 2013 06:27am
Don't Beat Yourself Up Either ...
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by OKREF (Post 878893)
Oops. Correct.
Don't lose sleep over this. It was real, real, close.

Camron Rust Wed Feb 13, 2013 06:34am
Quote:
Originally Posted by JetMetFan (Post 878936)
The defender has to obtain LGP before his opponent leaves the floor. I'd post a freeze if I could - I'm at work - but B1 does meet the requirement in this case. A1 was almost airborne but according to the rule almost isn't good enough.
A freeze frame will not help you...it will not show what you need to see.

There are a two reasons he doesn't have LGP but the only one you really need to consider is that B1 was moving towards the shooter all the way until the time of contact....well after A1 left the floor. That alone makes it a block.

You could see that if you get two freeze shots. If you freeze it at the time the shooter leaves the floor and then another freeze at the time of contact, you'll see that the defender has moved toward A1 in that interval (as was still moving). Just because the feet are still doesn't mean the defender isn't moving.

JetMetFan Wed Feb 13, 2013 06:51am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Camron Rust (Post 878942)
A freeze frame will not help you...it will not show what you need to see.

There are a two reasons he doesn't have LGP but the only one you really need to consider is that B1 was moving towards the shooter all the way until the time of contact....well after A1 left the floor. That alone makes it a block.

You could see that if you get two freeze shots. If you freeze it at the time the shooter leaves the floor and then another freeze at the time of contact, you'll see that the defender has moved toward A1 in that interval (as was still moving). Just because the feet are still doesn't mean the defender isn't moving.
That's where we're going to differ and that's why I referred to the defender being a statue. His upper body is going to be moving towards the shooter just as a matter of physics because his body is slowing down. If he doesn't break what would be his normal vertical plane then he hasn't done anything wrong.

Camron Rust Wed Feb 13, 2013 12:00pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by JetMetFan (Post 878944)
That's where we're going to differ and that's why I referred to the defender being a statue. His upper body is going to be moving towards the shooter just as a matter of physics because his body is slowing down. If he doesn't break what would be his normal vertical plane then he hasn't done anything wrong.
That is precisely why it is illegal.
4-23-3:
c. The guard may move laterally or obliquely to maintain position, provided it is not toward the opponent when contact occurs
The rules of guarding require that he get there in time to NOT be moving towards the shooter.

He doesn't get verticality until he is vertical. Moving into a vertical position after the shooter is airborne is NOT verticality..

Welpe Wed Feb 13, 2013 12:15pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich (Post 878922)
I agree with those who think we're asking too much of the defender if we're calling this a block.
I agree with you who agree with those.

scrounge Wed Feb 13, 2013 12:16pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by VaTerp (Post 878918)
IMO those of you saying block on play #1 are asking way too much of the defender.
I don't think it's asking too much of the defender to not move into the offensive player, airborne or not. He was *almost* there....but just not quite. I say block.

maven Wed Feb 13, 2013 01:11pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Welpe (Post 879088)
I agree with you who agree with those.
Do you agree with those, or just Rich?

Rich Wed Feb 13, 2013 01:14pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by maven (Post 879110)
Do you agree with those, or just Rich?
Can't we apply some transitive property here? :D

Welpe Wed Feb 13, 2013 01:38pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by maven (Post 879110)
Do you agree with those, or just Rich?
I feel a logic lesson coming on. :eek:

Rich Wed Feb 13, 2013 01:56pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Welpe (Post 879117)
I feel a logic lesson coming on. :eek:
A really tedious one, at that.

maven Wed Feb 13, 2013 02:11pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich (Post 879124)
A really tedious one, at that.
Hey, who tossed the word 'transitive' in like a grenade? :p

#olderthanilook Wed Feb 13, 2013 02:27pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Camron Rust (Post 879076)
That is precisely why it is illegal.
4-23-3:
c. The guard may move laterally or obliquely to maintain position, provided it is not toward the opponent when contact occurs
The rules of guarding require that he get there in time to NOT be moving towards the shooter.

He doesn't get verticality until he is vertical. Moving into a vertical position after the shooter is airborne is NOT verticality..
Players (and usually coaches) NEVER seem to understand this when the explanation is given.

Camron Rust Wed Feb 13, 2013 02:47pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by maven (Post 879131)
Hey, who tossed the word 'transitive' in like a grenade? :p
At least they didn't go commutative.

Texref Wed Feb 13, 2013 11:31pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by A Pennsylvania Coach (Post 878799)
1) Block
2) Tough angle here. I'm going to say no call--looks to me like the contact was just glancing based on the angle of the offensive player.
3) Easy PC.
My thoughts exactly. I have no problem with a no call in play 1, although clearly both officials follow the ball. It appears that defender is still moving after shooter goes airborne.

2. I think an easy, and thus correct, no call.

3. Easy Offensive call.

Red_Killian Thu Feb 14, 2013 12:21pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Camron Rust (Post 879076)
That is precisely why it is illegal.
4-23-3:
c. The guard may move laterally or obliquely to maintain position, provided it is not toward the opponent when contact occurs
The rules of guarding require that he get there in time to NOT be moving towards the shooter.

He doesn't get verticality until he is vertical. Moving into a vertical position after the shooter is airborne is NOT verticality..
Camron nails it for #1, I agree with block, no call, PC.


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