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-   -   Illegal sub after time-out vs intermission (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/93908-illegal-sub-after-time-out-vs-intermission.html)

Scratch85 Wed Feb 06, 2013 10:40am

Illegal sub after time-out vs intermission
 
Following a time-out, before the ball is made live, the table informs you that a player on the court did not report to the table. I believe it is a substitute technical as in 10-2-1.

Is it the same after intermission or between quarters?

JRutledge Wed Feb 06, 2013 10:45am

Not necessarily. It would depend on if they claimed to report the players before the warning horn. I would just play with whomever was last listed to play in the game and not go the T route after halftime. Honestly I am not sure I would give a T in the first situation unless they clearly were trying to pull something.

Peace

JetMetFan Wed Feb 06, 2013 10:49am

As JRut said, by rule it is. Whether you want to give yourself that kind of a headache is another story.

pfan1981 Wed Feb 06, 2013 11:08am

I was thinking about this at last night's game. On a timeout, I see a student check in as the second horn is blowing. Is it my responsibility to enforce the technical foul, or the scoring table's to inform me?

Thanks,

Ben

scrounge Wed Feb 06, 2013 11:12am

Quote:

Originally Posted by pfan1981 (Post 877384)
I was thinking about this at last night's game. On a timeout, I see a student check in as the second horn is blowing. Is it my responsibility to enforce the technical foul, or the scoring table's to inform me?

Thanks,

Ben


Seems like it would be a lot easier just to not let him come in the game till the next avail opportunity, since he didn't check in on time, if you must take any action.

Scratch85 Wed Feb 06, 2013 11:13am

No dispute about failure to report. Coach, player, team book and official book all agree and state that player did not report.

There are two parts to the sub technical. One for not reporting and one for not being beckoned. This one is not reporting.

If I understand JRut and JMF, it is a technical in either situation. Would it matter if the official has blown the whistle to begin play following the TO or intermission? By rule. I already know the headaches one can get from this situation.

Scratch85 Wed Feb 06, 2013 11:15am

Quote:

Originally Posted by pfan1981 (Post 877384)
I was thinking about this at last night's game. On a timeout, I see a student check in as the second horn is blowing. Is it my responsibility to enforce the technical foul, or the scoring table's to inform me?

Thanks,

Ben

If they reported, it is not a technical. Just hold them until next opportunity to sub.

pfan1981 Wed Feb 06, 2013 11:32am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scratch85 (Post 877391)
If they reported, it is not a technical. Just hold them until next opportunity to sub.

I have worked 100+ games at a scoring table, and I hold the athlete until the next whistle. Whose responsibility is it? Scoring table, referee, or both?

Scratch85 Wed Feb 06, 2013 11:37am

Quote:

Originally Posted by pfan1981 (Post 877405)
I have worked 100+ games at a scoring table, and I hold the athlete until the next whistle. Whose responsibility is it? Scoring table, referee, or both?

Referees beckon players into the game. So it is up to the ref whether to hold a player at the table or beckon them into the game. It is the table's responsibility to give the information needed to the ref.

So both. The table needs to let the ref know if the sub has not properly reported, then it is the ref's job to hold them.

bob jenkins Wed Feb 06, 2013 12:38pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scratch85 (Post 877388)
Would it matter if the official has blown the whistle to begin play following the TO or intermission? By rule.

Once the ball has become live, it's too late.

maven Wed Feb 06, 2013 01:11pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scratch85 (Post 877409)
Referees beckon players into the game. So it is up to the ref whether to hold a player at the table or beckon them into the game. It is the table's responsibility to give the information needed to the ref.

So both. The table needs to let the ref know if the sub has not properly reported, then it is the ref's job to hold them.

Officials don't "hold" players at the table. The players hold themselves until beckoned, or, if they fail to do so, are penalized accordingly.


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