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YooperReferee Tue Feb 05, 2013 01:24pm

Elbow/foul
 
Trap at division line, D commits foul for holding and O player fouled, swings elbows wildly and faster than torso, but makes no contact. O is in the bonus. Any clear cut answers?

johnny d Tue Feb 05, 2013 01:26pm

Yeah, foul on D. Nothing on O since his swinging elbows did not make contact, and the ball was already dead for the foul on D.

egj13 Tue Feb 05, 2013 01:27pm

So you called the foul on D and then the offensive player swung wildly?

Personally I would just shoot the throws since O is in the bonus and no contact was made.

Yoop, what would you have done if contact would have been made?

Scrapper1 Tue Feb 05, 2013 01:41pm

I agree with the previous answers unless you felt that the swinging was not just "to clear space", but was an attempt to strike one of the defenders. In that case, I have a technical foul (probably flagrant). But if it's a run-of-the-mill swing to get away from people, then I have nothing.

YooperReferee Tue Feb 05, 2013 01:56pm

Flagrant technical and disqualification on O, no free throws on flagrant, put O on line for 1 n 1 and continue from there.

APG Tue Feb 05, 2013 02:03pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by YooperReferee (Post 877175)
Flagrant technical and disqualification on O, no free throws on flagrant, put O on line for 1 n 1 and continue from there.


NFHS: You administer fouls in the order that they occur. So this is incorrect...2nd, why do you think free throws wouldn't be shot for a flagrant technical foul?

As to your scenario, foul on the defense and go on from there.

johnny d Tue Feb 05, 2013 02:05pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by YooperReferee (Post 877175)
Flagrant technical and disqualification on O, no free throws on flagrant, put O on line for 1 n 1 and continue from there.


No free throws on flagrant technical foul? All single technical fouls in nfhs are penalized by 2 free throws and ball to the offended team at division line.

YooperReferee Tue Feb 05, 2013 02:18pm

In the original scenario the whistle was for a hold on D, and a new caviat was introduced saying a elbow made contact during a dead ball

rockyroad Tue Feb 05, 2013 02:23pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by YooperReferee (Post 877185)
In the original scenario the whistle was for a hold on D, and a new caviat was introduced saying a elbow made contact during a dead ball

True, but doesn't answer the question of why you would not shoot free throws for the flagrant T.

Raymond Tue Feb 05, 2013 02:24pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by YooperReferee (Post 877185)
In the original scenario the whistle was for a hold on D, and a new caviat was introduced saying a elbow made contact during a dead ball

This doesn't answer why Team B (defensive team) doesn't get free throws for the flagrant technical foul committed by A1 (offensive player).

KevinP Tue Feb 05, 2013 02:59pm

First I believe that you administer the 1 n 1 to the offensive player who was originally fouled (with lanes cleared) then the 2 free throws to the Defensive team who's player was elbowed with the throw in division line

Camron Rust Tue Feb 05, 2013 03:06pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by KevinP (Post 877200)
First I believe that you administer the 1 n 1 to the offensive player who was originally fouled (with lanes cleared) then the 2 free throws to the Defensive team who's player was elbowed with the throw in division line

And the 1+1 is either shot by the original offensive player or, if he was DQ'd for a flagrant T, his substitute.


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