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-   -   NCAAM Flagrant 2 (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/93582-ncaam-flagrant-2-a.html)

stiffler3492 Fri Jan 18, 2013 04:57pm
NCAAM Flagrant 2
 
I think the player was given a Flagrant 2 on this play.

Here's a link to a page where there are several angles of the play: Is this the dirtiest play of the college basketball season so far? (GIF) | Off the Bench

Neither the ESPN nor the Valpo box score was any help in identifying the type of foul that was called, I just know the player was ejected.

Anyone think this should only be a flagrant 1?

Added by APG:

http://i0.wp.com/i.imgur.com/OdiU7.gif
http://i0.wp.com/i.imgur.com/5jaTz.gif

JugglingReferee Fri Jan 18, 2013 05:19pm
Fed.... thinking about the DQ.

Camron Rust Fri Jan 18, 2013 05:32pm
I was leaning towards an F1 upon seeing it...though I wouldn't argue with an F2 as it wasn't far from it. It was excessive contact but he did come across the front where the ball was.

I could easily see and argue for F2 if the same level of contact wasn't near the ball.

How I would rule could also be swayed by any previous issues in the game.

stiffler3492 Fri Jan 18, 2013 05:36pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Camron Rust (Post 873036)
I was leaning towards an F1 upon seeing it...though I wouldn't argue with an F2 as it wasn't far from it. It was excessive contact but he did come across the front where the ball was.

I could easily see and argue for F2 if the same level of contact wasn't near the ball.

How I would rule could also be swayed by any previous issues in the game.
I agree with this

just another ref Fri Jan 18, 2013 05:37pm
NFHS flagrant technical

Rich Fri Jan 18, 2013 05:38pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by just another ref (Post 873039)
NFHS flagrant technical
Try again.

just another ref Fri Jan 18, 2013 05:45pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich (Post 873040)
Try again.
don't think so

Camron Rust Fri Jan 18, 2013 06:11pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by just another ref (Post 873039)
NFHS flagrant technical
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich (Post 873040)
Try again.
Quote:
Originally Posted by just another ref (Post 873043)
don't think so
Try again....a fragrant technical is not among your available options.

just another ref Fri Jan 18, 2013 06:40pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Camron Rust (Post 873046)
Try again....a fragrant technical is not among your available options.
Actually it is. Keep looking.

rockyroad Fri Jan 18, 2013 06:48pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by just another ref (Post 873049)
Actually it is. Keep looking.
Uhmmm...according to 4-19-4, in order to be a flagrant T it has to be a dead ball.

johnny d Fri Jan 18, 2013 07:28pm
we have had these discussions before. contact, while the ball is live, whether flagrant or not cannot be a technical foul.

i have a flagrant 1 on this play. defender pretty clearly goes after the ball. yes there is excessive body contact, which is why i am going ff1. imo, it looks really bad because we have a much smaller airborne player being knocked to the ground by a much larger and stronger player. defensive player does nothing extra to try to drive the player into the ground, so unless there was something similar previously by this player i would not go ff2.

just another ref Fri Jan 18, 2013 11:20pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by rockyroad (Post 873050)
Uhmmm...according to 4-19-4, in order to be a flagrant T it has to be a dead ball.
Yep. When the contact occurred, it was a dead ball if I'd had a whistle.

APG Fri Jan 18, 2013 11:39pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by just another ref (Post 873059)
Yep. When the contact occurred, it was a dead ball if I'd had a whistle.
Are you watching the same gif? Unless you're trying to be cute and imply that you think there was a travel...

http://i0.wp.com/i.imgur.com/OdiU7.gif
http://i0.wp.com/i.imgur.com/5jaTz.gif

As to the play, I have a flagrant 2. Wind up, significant impact around the shoulder area, and a follow through. Ejection.

just another ref Fri Jan 18, 2013 11:45pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by APG (Post 873061)
Are you watching the same gif? Unless you're trying to be cute and imply that you think there was a travel.
Not implying it, nothing cute about it. There was a travel.

Raymond Fri Jan 18, 2013 11:59pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by just another ref (Post 873062)
Not implying it, nothing cute about it. There was a travel.
It was a travel, but it's one that never gets called.


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