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egj13 Fri Jan 04, 2013 11:40am

End of game communication
 
Worked a VG game last night...H team is down 3, V team fouls to send H to line for 1 and 1 with 2.8 remaining. (good coaching move by the way). Girl makes first and H coach calls time out. We get together real quick, discuss lane violations and shot hitting the rim assuming he will have her miss the shot. We forget to discuss one thing...clock starting.

Girl makes second shot...V team throws ball away on the inbounds..H steals, shoots, misses, rebounds shoots and makes it to win. Place is going nuts since H team won...until we wave it off.

No complaints from H coach since it was clear it took more than 2.8 seconds and we were actually blowing it dead as the second shot went up..but lesson learned on things to communicate in that situation.

Rich Fri Jan 04, 2013 11:47am

Quote:

Originally Posted by egj13 (Post 870054)
Worked a VG game last night...H team is down 3, V team fouls to send H to line for 1 and 1 with 2.8 remaining. (good coaching move by the way). Girl makes first and H coach calls time out. We get together real quick, discuss lane violations and shot hitting the rim assuming he will have her miss the shot. We forget to discuss one thing...clock starting.

Girl makes second shot...V team throws ball away on the inbounds..H steals, shoots, misses, rebounds shoots and makes it to win. Place is going nuts since H team won...until we wave it off.

No complaints from H coach since it was clear it took more than 2.8 seconds and we were actually blowing it dead as the second shot went up..but lesson learned on things to communicate in that situation.

This isn't something that really requires a discussion -- the official responsible for the last second shot needs to look at the clock and ensure it starts. It's something I do regardless of my position on the floor.

egj13 Fri Jan 04, 2013 12:06pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rich (Post 870056)
This isn't something that really requires a discussion -- the official responsible for the last second shot needs to look at the clock and ensure it starts. It's something I do regardless of my position on the floor.

C had tapped his chest before the first shot taking responsibility (opposite table) but I think it caught us by suprise that she made the second shot...we were all looking for a miss I believe. So we knew who had the clock and in postgame he admitted he blew it but if we had communicated during the timeout it might not have gotten overlooked.

ballgame99 Fri Jan 04, 2013 12:13pm

Good post. So just a little home cooking by the table? Did the clock just not start at all or just really late?

egj13 Fri Jan 04, 2013 12:19pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by ballgame99 (Post 870077)
Good post. So just a little home cooking by the table? Did the clock just not start at all or just really late?

Didn't start at all..when we blew it dead there was still 2.8 on the clock.

No home cooking here..it was a really good game and he just got caught up in the excitement.

Little background...this is by far the smallest HS gym in MT that I have seen. H team school enrollment is 26 (9-12) and I believe 23 of the kids are on either the B or G basketball teams. So the whole town is packed into this small..and I mean small gym and the girls have been pretty bad this year. For them to be in this situation had everyone..including the clock guy I guess...on the edge of the seat. It was a fun night!

26 Year Gap Fri Jan 04, 2013 12:22pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by egj13 (Post 870083)
Didn't start at all..when we blew it dead there was still 2.8 on the clock.

No home cooking here..it was a really good game and he just got caught up in the excitement.

Little background...this is by far the smallest HS gym in MT that I have seen. H team school enrollment is 26 (9-12) and I believe 23 of the kids are on either the B or G basketball teams. So the whole town is packed into this small..and I mean small gym and the girls have been pretty bad this year. For them to be in this situation had everyone..including the clock guy I guess...on the edge of the seat. It was a fun night!

Noisy gyms are the best. The old Craftsbury Academy gym in VT was replaced this year. Short court. Overhead obstructions. No division line. Restraining lines. Backboard affixed to wall. Great atmosphere.

johnny d Fri Jan 04, 2013 12:23pm

enrollment is 26, how do they even keep the school open?

bob jenkins Fri Jan 04, 2013 12:25pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rich (Post 870056)
This isn't something that really requires a discussion -- the official responsible for the last second shot needs to look at the clock and ensure it starts.

Except that if the ball is immediately in his / her area that official might not be able to do so.

Quote:

It's something I do regardless of my position on the floor.
Yes, if off-ball or if possible while on-ball.

egj13 Fri Jan 04, 2013 12:28pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnny d (Post 870086)
enrollment is 26, how do they even keep the school open?

Good old Montana!!

When I got here last year my first game was in that gym..the division line is only about 10 feet past the 3 point line and if you wear bigger than a size 10 you aren't shooting from the corners...and I was like "what hillbilly place do they have me in?" But after being in that atmosphere with the whole town there, loud, it wasn't the same when I went back to the big schools.

It is hard to explain unless you have been here but they have some really small rural schools in this area and they love their teams!

Rich Fri Jan 04, 2013 01:05pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by bob jenkins (Post 870087)
Except that if the ball is immediately in his / her area that official might not be able to do so.

Fair comment.

icallfouls Fri Jan 04, 2013 01:16pm

Why not go to table and remind them to start the clock on your chop?

Had a situation several years ago. Tie game, visiting teams ball, had to go the length of the floor to win, 2.3 on the clock. Visitors last time out is called. I told the clock to watch for partners chop on inbound. What happens? time keeper starts clock as ball is handed to visitors. They throw long pass and the ball is deflected then recovered by visitors.

Now the home team sets up to avoid long pass and score and visitors lose in OT.

egj13 Fri Jan 04, 2013 01:24pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by icallfouls (Post 870101)
Why not go to table and remind them to start the clock on your chop?

Good point...and will probably add that next time I am in that situation.

I really think the whole place was suprised when she made the second shot..just wasn't expected after he had just called tim out.

Scuba_ref Fri Jan 04, 2013 01:55pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by egj13 (Post 870089)
Good old Montana!!

When I got here last year my first game was in that gym..the division line is only about 10 feet past the 3 point line and if you wear bigger than a size 10 you aren't shooting from the corners...and I was like "what hillbilly place do they have me in?" But after being in that atmosphere with the whole town there, loud, it wasn't the same when I went back to the big schools.

It is hard to explain unless you have been here but they have some really small rural schools in this area and they love their teams!

My first few years of officiating were in Montana. More cows that people in the two counties we covered and the gyms were always packed. Very few schools here can match the atmosphere created in those small gyms.

just another ref Fri Jan 04, 2013 02:01pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by egj13 (Post 870054)
Worked a VG game last night...H team is down 3, V team fouls to send H to line for 1 and 1 with 2.8 remaining. (good coaching move by the way). Girl makes first and H coach calls time out. We get together real quick, discuss lane violations and shot hitting the rim assuming he will have her miss the shot. We forget to discuss one thing...clock starting.

Girl makes second shot...V team throws ball away on the inbounds..H steals, shoots, misses, rebounds shoots and makes it to win. Place is going nuts since H team won...until we wave it off.

No complaints from H coach since it was clear it took more than 2.8 seconds and we were actually blowing it dead as the second shot went up..but lesson learned on things to communicate in that situation.

In retrospect, how much time are you estimating actually elapsed?

egj13 Fri Jan 04, 2013 02:54pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by just another ref (Post 870114)
In retrospect, how much time are you estimating actually elapsed?

Good questions because 2.8 can be a "long" time. My guess is 4 seconds at least..steal, shoot, rebound, shoot.


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