Is this a foul?

[olliemuh]

I play ball with a few friends a couple of times a week. Recently, we got into an argument about a couple of matters. I am a lot bigger than anyone I play with by a few inches and 40 pounds of muscle. I post up just outside the paint on the right side, between the first and second marks on the side (not an official, don't quite know the language). I get the ball and turn my back to the defender. I begin to back in slowly, using my extra strength to put them below the basket. I spin and shoot, not reall noticing weather they are really in the way or not, but they were securly on my back when I started my move. Or I do what I have seen in many NBA games and use my extra weight to push them back with my rear, or push them off of me with my shoulders. My thought is that I am getting fouled quite a bit, and that this may go toward me, but the group is getting more agressive with their take as I the one fouling. Who is right? And another quick one, if I drive to the hoop and duck my shoulder to get underneath the defenders arm, am I charging?

[RookieDude]

First off...welcome to the board. Glad to have you.

Second off...NBA isn't basketball, it's entertainment.
OK, maybe it is a form of basketball, but you certainly don't want to watch it and form any rules interprutations.

A friendly pick up game with the guys should be just that...friendly.

Where I play, if a guy thinks he got fouled then he calls it. If the contact dosen't effect the outcome of the desired play, then he might "let it go".
Heck, many times a pick up game without an official go smoother than with a couple guys blowing those annoying things around their neck.
In other words, when a guy gets fouled he knows it...he dosen't miss it like an official might, or he won't pass on the call if he thinks he could have finished the play without the contact.

Having said all that...your basic question seems to be, "Can a player displace another player on the court because he dosen't have '40 more pounds of muscle' to keep from being displaced"? The answer is NO. That little guy deserves a spot on the court. If he is behind you and crawling all over your back or kneeing you in the A#@...call the foul. I know you just want to "back him up" because you are bigger, but that is not legal either. He deserves that spot on the floor, you can not legally move him without fouling him. BTW, if you have the ball in that situation it would be called a "player control" foul...many times the guys at the gym simply call it an "offensive foul".

A quick answer to your quick question about "ducking" your shoulder "to get underneath the defenders arm"...sorry dude, again, if the defender is set you cannot displace him by ducking your shoulder or any other means. However, that is a great move for a football player to make when wanting to avoid being stopped. (Somehow, I think you probably have played a little football in your time)

Hopefully these observations will help...keep on playing and keep on asking, it can only improve your game.

Dude

[olliemuh]

Thanks for the reply. it helps to know what I can and cannot do.

[BktBallRef]

olliemuh, I'm talking basketball rules here, not what may or may not be allowed in pickup games.

If he has position and you back him down and displace him, you've fouled.

If he hgas position and you turn into him and displace him, you've fouled him.

If he has position, jumps straight up, and you turn and lower your shoulder into him, you've fouled him.

[rainmaker]

Originally posted by RookieDude
A quick answer to your quick question about "ducking" your shoulder "to get underneath the defenders arm"...sorry dude, again, if the defender is set you cannot displace him by ducking your shoulder or any other means.

Rook --

You are correct, if the ducking is to get the shoulder firmly into the defender, but I'm reading the play a little differently. Perhaps I'm mis-interpreting, but I wonder if Ollie isn't saying that he's ducking BELOW the arm of the defender which is off to the side. In that case, if there's no contact, there's certainly no foul. However, if he means ducking below an arm-bar to get to the defender's body, of course that's PC. Ollie if this second case iw the situation you describe, you could possibly get away with just running into the arm-bar, which is not legal. However, I think you should verify ahead of time that this rule is a valid one in your park.

[AK ref SE]

olliemuh-
Think of it this way also, if the table was turned and you weighed 40 pounds less, and were two inches shorter. Would you want the ability to hold your ground, and if they were using there weight to push you under the basket or displace you have the foul called in the dribbler?
Just a thought!

AK ref SE

[mplagrow]

Basically, watch anything that Shaq does when he backs down an opponent to the basket. If you do anything that he does, it was a foul! Not that it would ever be called on him. . . .